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Randomguy

Happy Bastille Day, and the major lesson from it...

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21 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

When the french stormed the Bastille, the message delivered was that whenever the populace cedes control to those charged with representing them, that they can take that control back when misrepresented.

We give you power, we can take it away.  Voting works, except when all sorts of malfeasance occurs with corrupt politicians (redistricting, closing polls early, making it difficult for the "wrong people" to vote).  When confidence in both the leadership AND voting is nonexistent, storming the Bastille becomes an option if a country goes completely to shit.

This should be a massive lesson to the entrenched and the rich, that when systems in place massively favor their interests, you better fucking give at least a little shit about the general population or they will be coming for you, and violently if things get really bad.  Deservedly so.  

So if we think the French are wimps when taken unawares in world wars, they at least had the balls to take back their country when they were getting shit on.

Happy Bastille Day!

Hmm.  You did see military-style action and equipment used to clear assembled folks for a photo op, correct?  We have some gutsy folks and we have some evil folks.  The lines are becoming clearer all the time. :(

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3 hours ago, Randomguy said:

When the french stormed the Bastille, the message delivered was that whenever the populace cedes control to those charged with representing them, that they can take that control back when misrepresented.

We give you power, we can take it away.  Voting works, except when all sorts of malfeasance occurs with corrupt politicians (redistricting, closing polls early, making it difficult for the "wrong people" to vote).  When confidence in both the leadership AND voting is nonexistent, storming the Bastille becomes an option if a country goes completely to shit.

This should be a massive lesson to the entrenched and the rich, that when systems in place massively favor their interests, you better fucking give at least a little shit about the general population or they will be coming for you, and violently if things get really bad.  Deservedly so.  

So if we think the French are wimps when taken unawares in world wars, they at least had the balls to take back their country when they were getting shit on.

Happy Bastille Day!

Good Points.  Of course, The Reign of Terror that followed is also a massive lesson that the new leadership can't be given absolute power and more than one point of view must be allowed.  Additionally, note that Mohandas Gandhi said that his protests against British rule of India only worked because the British Government was not a ruthless dictatorship.  Louis XVI's power had been significantly reduced leading up to Bastille Day.

French Revolution wasn't meant to be peaceful and it wasn't: it violently terminated all opposition.  La Marseilles, the French National Anthem written just after the revolution, which I had to learn and sing in French classes, has the line, "L'étendard sanglant est levé" - The bloody standard is raised.

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I'm reminded of Bastille day when watching the TdF.

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27 minutes ago, bikeman564™ said:

I'm reminded of Bastille day when watching the TdF.

The traffic coming off the mountain is terrible, and the only food choices for dinner when back in a town is donar kabab. But it’s a wonderful experience.

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4 hours ago, Razors Edge said:

You did see military-style action and equipment used to clear assembled folks for a photo op, correct?

That’s true, but Trump also hid in a basement bunker for an extended period of time before deciding to clear the area for a photo op. So “Bunker Boy” was scared enough to a) retreat and b) call in the military, which makes me think an unannounced, random Tuesday storming could potentially succeed, at least until reinforcements came, and a helicopter gunship.

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5 hours ago, Randomguy said:

We give you power, we can take it away. 

A good reason for the Second Amendment.

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7 minutes ago, JerrySTL said:

A good reason for the Second Amendment.

Until the helicopter gunship comes in.

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5 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

Until the helicopter gunship comes in.

Eerily close to tromping on the First Amendment.  Peaceful assemblies with folks with lots of grievances.  And then the tear gas and later the military helicopters come rolling in.  I can't say meeting that unlawful and disgusting show of force with equal force using 2nd Amendment rights would have been a good idea.  FAR more powerful, in the US, is a FAIR and OPEN Press and then FAIR and OPEN Elections.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

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I thought this was just the feminine version of Bastid day.

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32 minutes ago, maddmaxx said:

I thought this was just the feminine version of Bastid day.

Well, they are French. :dontknow:

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21 hours ago, JerrySTL said:

A good reason for the Second Amendment.

 

20 hours ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

Until the helicopter gunship comes in.

Ok, here goes. 

I think the second amendment is useless against the federal government in a showdown longer than a day.  Our military really is one of the few categories where there really is no debate as to our place in the world, we are the best overall there.  Best or near best (in all listed categories) armed, best organized, best equipped, best logistical support, best communication network, etc.  You only have to compare them to other militaries around the world to realize this.

The only thing stopping our military from firing on our citizens in a conflict is the fact that the armed force's soldiers do not want to fire on Americans.   Sure, some will if ordered, but most don't want to do that if unjust and presumably would start refusing, deserting, etc if somebody like the current president ordered them to.  Clearing the lawn left a bad taste in people's mouths, that carries over. Bubba and Bubba's uneducated family can buy assault rifles and some may be able to use them when fire is not being returned, but against a concerted assault by the world's best military?  Not a fucking chance in hell of succeeding.  Sure, there would be some casualties, but still, no way to win that one.   

I don't believe assault rifles should be allowed in the general public where all they seem to do is shoot up schoolchildren, concert-goers, and gang members.  Give everyone in the states an assault rifle and still no way to defeat the military in a sustained way.  Only a quick, overwhelming storming of the government could succeed, and only if the military supported that.

Second amendment  worked well when everyone had muskets and militia's were easy to form and organize, not when we have stealth bombers, tanks, and other shreddy Betty's all lined up and looking for mow-down opportunity.  It really is just the assault rifles causing the bulk of the issues in the private sector, but most folks who have to go out and buy five of them is because something is desperately wrong in their heads.  Those people lash out effectively when unopposed, but seem less likely (or unable) to organize in anything other then a nominal way.

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3 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

Ok, here goes. 

I think a good example is how well COUNTRIES with ARMIES have done against the focused US military.  Not very well. Some never recover from the beating.  We do restrict our military use on US soil (under normal leadership), and even our near-military folks like the FBI or the ATF hold back a LOT when dealing with folks like idiots out west who caused mayhem a few years back.  Sadly, to think we'll change things FOR THE BETTER by armed revolution is no longer a reasonable assumption. There's now only one direction toppling a government like ours - in any way other than traditional landslide elections - will lead and its a bad place to go.

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20 hours ago, Razors Edge said:

FAR more powerful, in the US, is a FAIR and OPEN Press

That right there would be a great idea...

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1 minute ago, Kzoo said:

That right there would be a great idea...

Get BLOGGING!!!!

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23 hours ago, Kzoo said:

That right there would be a great idea...

Plus a government that could somehow, someway, even attempt to tell the truth once in a while would be a great idea, too.  Most people seem unequipped to tell truth from lie, and just believe the liars instead of thinking for themselves and checking sources.  Lower life forms prefer to question the press instead of demanding answers from elected officials or recognizing well-established patterns of deceit in them.

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