bikeman564™ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #1 Posted June 24, 2021 https://nypost.com/2021/06/24/building-partially-collapses-near-miami-beach/ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted June 24, 2021 Share #2 Posted June 24, 2021 That's really wierd ...but then what is building code enforcement like in Florida? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsnip Totin Jack ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #3 Posted June 24, 2021 Just now, shootingstar said: That's really wierd ...but then what is building code enforcement like in Florida? Any building can pass code with the right amount of cash. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickinMD ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #4 Posted June 24, 2021 "“This is a horrific catastrophe. In the United States, buildings just don’t fall down,” Surfside Mayor Charles Burkett said, CNN reported." When we were being driven from an overnight hotel in Fort Lauderdale to our cruise ship in Miami in 2017, the taxi driver said buildings were going up so fast there that there were serious concerns about the quality of the work and that there weren't enough inspectors to do proper inspections. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #5 Posted June 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, MickinMD said: "“This is a horrific catastrophe. In the United States, buildings just don’t fall down,” Surfside Mayor Charles Burkett said, CNN reported." When we were being driven from an overnight hotel in Fort Lauderdale to our cruise ship in Miami in 2017, the taxi driver said buildings were going up so fast there that there were serious concerns about the quality of the work and that there weren't enough inspectors to do proper inspections. You'd think that @tybeegb might pass the word that permits and inspection work is HOT in Florida. That's the big leagues compared to his tiny slice of near paradise. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #6 Posted June 24, 2021 Witnesses said it sounded like a bomb went off. How come nobody is suspecting it was a bomb? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #7 Posted June 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Longjohn said: Witnesses said it sounded like a bomb went off. How come nobody is suspecting it was a bomb? Maybe it is something that can be determined relatively quickly by the first responders or building folks? They are not ruling that out, since apparently "Cause of Champlain Towers collapse in Surfside not known", but it is likely more related to "the building had been undergoing a major renovation". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted June 24, 2021 Share #8 Posted June 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Longjohn said: Witnesses said it sounded like a bomb went off. How come nobody is suspecting it was a bomb? It was my thought this morning. I have no idea why else a 40 year old concrete building would collapse without an Earthquake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikeguy Posted June 24, 2021 Share #9 Posted June 24, 2021 Kind of looks like the Oklahoma City building after a bomb went off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #10 Posted June 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Prophet Zacharia said: It was my thought this morning. I have no idea why else a 40 year old concrete building would collapse without an Earthquake. You don't think "undergoing major renovations" could be a factor? Bomb or work being done on building goes sideways? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted June 24, 2021 Share #11 Posted June 24, 2021 12 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: You don't think "undergoing major renovations" could be a factor? Bomb or work being done on building goes sideways? I’ve never heard of a renovation project taking down half of a twelve story building. Let’s hope this is a first for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Kosciuszko Posted June 24, 2021 Share #12 Posted June 24, 2021 I'd suspect a sinkhole... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #13 Posted June 24, 2021 This is not good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #14 Posted June 24, 2021 14 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said: I’ve never heard of a renovation project taking down half of a twelve story building. Let’s hope this is a first for me. I'm not saying it is A or B (or the sinkhole), but I have seen countless mistakes during construction, and only a few bombed buildings, so I generally lean in the "what's more likely" direction of things. Obviously, someone will work hard to determine WTF actually happened - from crazed bomber to simple @2Far-style foolishness. Put the wrong dudes in charge of doing something and all hell can and will break loose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Far ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #15 Posted June 24, 2021 49 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said: I’ve never heard of a renovation project taking down half of a twelve story building. Let’s hope this is a first for me. Well, not Ed Zachary the same, but there were some welders who started a fire on the roof of a CDC building here. Not a CDC office building, if you know what I mean and I think that you do. The article I read said that they had been working on the roof as a part of the 40 year recert of the building. Unless they piled all their shit up there ala the MN bridge over the Mississippi, it may have been a combination of errors. The article said it "pancaked" down, so a roof event will be looked at hard. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted June 24, 2021 Share #16 Posted June 24, 2021 A video... https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2021/06/24/surfside-florida-moment-of-building-collapse-vpx.cnn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #17 Posted June 24, 2021 Somebody upstairs left the water running. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Far ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #18 Posted June 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Kzoo said: A video... https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2021/06/24/surfside-florida-moment-of-building-collapse-vpx.cnn Dunno, that didn't look like a pancake event to me, more like a controlled demolition. I spose something could have let loose in the middle, pancaking downwards and the top followed behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted June 24, 2021 Share #19 Posted June 24, 2021 37 minutes ago, 2Far said: but there were some welders who started a fire on the roof What was the cause of the Hard Rock collapse during construction in New Orleans? Was it a welding accident? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted June 24, 2021 Share #20 Posted June 24, 2021 17 minutes ago, 2Far said: Dunno, that didn't look like a pancake event to me, more like a controlled demolition. I spose something could have let loose in the middle, pancaking downwards and the top followed behind. Like a sinkhole? We probably would have heard about that by now. Getting sucked into a sinkhole can really complicate rescue/recovery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Far ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #21 Posted June 24, 2021 56 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said: What was the cause of the Hard Rock collapse during construction in New Orleans? Was it a welding accident? Either bad design or not enough reshore under the previously poured floors. Concrete floors take about 30 days to cure to self-supportedness. They put in a Sherwood Forest of 4"x4"s to support each <30-day-old floor after they take out the supports they originally put in to pour the floor. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #22 Posted June 24, 2021 6 hours ago, shootingstar said: That's really wierd ...but then what is building code enforcement like in Florida? Very stringent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Far ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #23 Posted June 24, 2021 1 hour ago, 2Far said: Either bad design or not enough reshore under the previously poured floors. Concrete floors take about 30 days to cure to self-supportedness. They put in a Sherwood Forest of 4"x4"s to support each <30-day-old floor after they take out the supports they originally put in to pour the floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted June 24, 2021 Share #24 Posted June 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, 2Far said: Is that duct tape used to join those 4x4”s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #25 Posted June 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said: Is that duct tape used to join those 4x4”s? Gorilla. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Far ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #26 Posted June 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Prophet Zacharia said: Is that duct tape used to join those 4x4”s? The ones I recall were some kind of band iron straps, the weight on the upper 4x4 caused the strap to angle downwards, digging into both 4x4s to keep them from sliding. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted June 24, 2021 Share #27 Posted June 24, 2021 1 minute ago, maddmaxx said: Gorilla. Whew. Just now, 2Far said: The ones I recall were some kind of band iron straps, the weight on the upper 4x4 caused the strap to angle downwards, digging into both 4x4s to keep them from sliding. Thanks. On my phone they just look taped together! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Far ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #28 Posted June 24, 2021 Here's a better pic of the method: 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #29 Posted June 24, 2021 So the building was built on reclaimed wetland. Has been sinking since the 1990s when it was going down 2mm per year. I am thinking that it was under a ton of internal stress and something snapped and the whole thing came down. https://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-miami-condo-sinking-earth-181026431.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #30 Posted June 24, 2021 4 hours ago, Thaddeus Kosciuszko said: I'd suspect a sinkhole... My first thought too when I hear Florida. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted June 24, 2021 Share #31 Posted June 24, 2021 7 minutes ago, jsharr said: So the building was built on reclaimed wetland. Has been sinking since the 1990s when it was going down 2mm per year. I am thinking that it was under a ton of internal stress and something snapped and the whole thing came down. https://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-miami-condo-sinking-earth-181026431.html A whole bunch of lawyers are going to make a whole lot of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #32 Posted June 24, 2021 33 minutes ago, jsharr said: it was going down 2mm per year. INCHES!!! Or fractions of inches!! What are you, a CAnadian?!?!? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #33 Posted June 24, 2021 31 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: INCHES!!! Or fractions of inches!! What are you, a CAnadian?!?!? Do you understand the decimal system? 0.0787402" per year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #34 Posted June 24, 2021 49 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: INCHES!!! Or fractions of inches!! What are you, a CAnadian?!?!? What size is your bike frame? Perhaps for you a Huffy in inches is called for, 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisL Posted June 24, 2021 Share #35 Posted June 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, maddmaxx said: What size is your bike frame? Perhaps for you a Huffy in inches is called for, Large! 😁 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #36 Posted June 24, 2021 Looks like this is going to wind up in engineering textbooks along with the Tacoma Narrows Bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikeguy Posted June 24, 2021 Share #37 Posted June 24, 2021 6 hours ago, Thaddeus Kosciuszko said: I'd suspect a sinkhole... That was my first guess.. The talking heads on TV already have explained how that was not the cause. Not sure how they know that... Then I moved on to the time of the collapse, 1:30 AM. I'm now guessing.. some drunk drove into an underground parking garage and hit a support column. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #38 Posted June 24, 2021 36 minutes ago, Bikeguy said: That was my first guess.. The talking heads on TV already have explained how that was not the cause. Not sure how they know that... Then I moved on to the time of the collapse, 1:30 AM. I'm now guessing.. some drunk drove into an underground parking garage and hit a support column. Yeah, they said there are supposed to be backup systems to prevent a collapse like this. I thought I heard 630 am though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #39 Posted June 24, 2021 33 minutes ago, Bikeguy said: I'm now guessing.. some drunk drove into an underground parking garage and hit a support column. Do they have underground parking in Miami? Wouldn't that also be underwater???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted June 24, 2021 Share #40 Posted June 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: Do they have underground parking in Miami? Wouldn't that also be underwater???? If not underground then 1st few floors probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikeguy Posted June 25, 2021 Share #41 Posted June 25, 2021 41 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: Do they have underground parking in Miami? Wouldn't that also be underwater???? Wow.... just eliminate a good bad guess in less than 20 minutes. Yeah... I'd expect water. The building was slowing sinking... and FL is famous for sink holes. Time will tell... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted June 25, 2021 Share #42 Posted June 25, 2021 12 hours ago, jsharr said: So the building was built on reclaimed wetland. Maybe on an old Indian burial ground, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted June 25, 2021 Share #43 Posted June 25, 2021 Perhaps building high rise structures on barrier islands with shifting sands and rising waters is going to prove to be a somewhat less than optimum idea. This may just be the beginning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickinMD ★ Posted June 25, 2021 Share #44 Posted June 25, 2021 20 hours ago, Bikeguy said: Kind of looks like the Oklahoma City building after a bomb went off. My cousin said the same to me last night! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickinMD ★ Posted June 25, 2021 Share #45 Posted June 25, 2021 I got up, made breakfast, and began watching TV half-asleep at 6:30 am this morning. MSNBC was interviewing some safety official from Montgomery County, Maryland who was describing rescue efforts. The discussion implied a local event - maybe the safety guy was in Miami but I was still half asleep and the dead/injured totals seemed too low to be Miami by this morning. I thought, "Oh no! Another condo collapse! is this a terrorist attack," - like when the 2nd plane hit the Twin Towers in NYC we knew it wasn't an accident. I switched to the local news channels and not a single mention of a condo collapse in Montgomery County. Slowly, I realized it was Miami and they've still got 99 missing. I hope a lot were away from home, but the timing of the collapse is bad for that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted June 25, 2021 Share #46 Posted June 25, 2021 12 hours ago, Razors Edge said: Do they have underground parking in Miami? Wouldn't that also be underwater???? Apparently they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airehead Posted June 25, 2021 Share #47 Posted June 25, 2021 All so sad. 99 is a lot of people missing. I heard some talking head say the death toll was low--- yeah right, but what of all the missing? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted June 25, 2021 Share #48 Posted June 25, 2021 53 minutes ago, Airehead said: All so sad. 99 is a lot of people missing. I heard some talking head say the death toll was low--- yeah right, but what of all the missing? Missing is just a temporary holding place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted June 25, 2021 Share #49 Posted June 25, 2021 1 hour ago, Prophet Zacharia said: Apparently they do. Which makes it seem pretty challenging to both build and maintain, for sure. I would hope - especially in a fairly old and established building - that folks in Florida know how to build and work on buildings in less than ideal locations. I also hope that this is not an issue that other buildings might also have in that area or of the era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted June 25, 2021 Share #50 Posted June 25, 2021 37 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: Which makes it seem pretty challenging to both build and maintain, for sure. I would hope - especially in a fairly old and established building - that folks in Florida know how to build and work on buildings in less than ideal locations. I also hope that this is not an issue that other buildings might also have in that area or of the era. It’s (was) a fairly new building at only 40 years old. I would Imagine much of the Miami area has much older buildings of similar and taller heights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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