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highrise collapse in Miami

bikeman564™

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MickinMD KOM / QOM

MickinMD ★

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"“This is a horrific catastrophe. In the United States, buildings just don’t fall down,” Surfside Mayor Charles Burkett said, CNN reported."

When we were being driven from an overnight hotel in Fort Lauderdale to our cruise ship in Miami in 2017, the taxi driver said buildings were going up so fast there that there were serious concerns about the quality of the work and that there weren't enough inspectors to do proper inspections.

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Razors Edge Flahute

Razors Edge ★

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4 minutes ago, MickinMD said:

"“This is a horrific catastrophe. In the United States, buildings just don’t fall down,” Surfside Mayor Charles Burkett said, CNN reported."

When we were being driven from an overnight hotel in Fort Lauderdale to our cruise ship in Miami in 2017, the taxi driver said buildings were going up so fast there that there were serious concerns about the quality of the work and that there weren't enough inspectors to do proper inspections.

You'd think that @tybeegb might pass the word that permits and inspection work is HOT in Florida.  That's the big leagues compared to his tiny slice of near paradise.

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Razors Edge Flahute

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5 minutes ago, Longjohn said:

Witnesses said it sounded like a bomb went off. How come nobody is suspecting it was a bomb?

Maybe it is something that can be determined relatively quickly by the first responders or building folks? 

They are not ruling that out, since apparently "Cause of Champlain Towers collapse in Surfside not known", but it is likely more related to "the building had been undergoing a major renovation".

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Razors Edge Flahute

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1 hour ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

It was my thought this morning. I have no idea why else a 40 year old concrete building would collapse without an Earthquake.

You don't think "undergoing major renovations" could be a factor?  Bomb or work being done on building goes sideways?

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Razors Edge Flahute

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14 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

I’ve never heard of a renovation project taking down half of a twelve story building. Let’s hope this is a first for me.

I'm not saying it is A or B (or the sinkhole), but I have seen countless mistakes during construction, and only a few bombed buildings, so I generally lean in the "what's more likely" direction of things.  Obviously, someone will work hard to determine WTF actually happened - from crazed bomber to simple @2Far-style foolishness. Put the wrong dudes in charge of doing something and all hell can and will break loose.

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2Far KOM / QOM

2Far ★

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49 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

I’ve never heard of a renovation project taking down half of a twelve story building. Let’s hope this is a first for me.

Well, not Ed Zachary the same, but there were some welders who started a fire on the roof of a CDC building here. Not a CDC office building, if you know what I mean and I think that you do.

The article I read said that they had been working on the roof as a part of the 40 year recert of the building. Unless they piled all their shit up there ala the MN bridge over the Mississippi, it may have been a combination of errors. The article said it "pancaked" down, so a roof event will be looked at hard.

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Kzoo Flahute

Kzoo

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17 minutes ago, 2Far said:

Dunno, that didn't look like a pancake event to me, more like a controlled demolition. I spose something could have let loose in the middle, pancaking downwards and the top followed behind.

Like a sinkhole?

We probably would have heard about that by now.  Getting sucked into a sinkhole can really complicate rescue/recovery.

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2Far KOM / QOM

2Far ★

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56 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

What was the cause of the Hard Rock collapse during construction in New Orleans? Was it a welding accident?

Either bad design or not enough reshore under the previously poured floors. Concrete floors take about 30 days to cure to self-supportedness. They put in a Sherwood Forest of 4"x4"s to support each <30-day-old floor after they take out the supports they originally put in to pour the floor.

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2Far KOM / QOM

2Far ★

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1 hour ago, 2Far said:

Either bad design or not enough reshore under the previously poured floors. Concrete floors take about 30 days to cure to self-supportedness. They put in a Sherwood Forest of 4"x4"s to support each <30-day-old floor after they take out the supports they originally put in to pour the floor.

Ellis MFG. CO. on Twitter: &quot;Ellis reshores for days. Thanks for the pic @lithkocontracting . #shoring #concrete #ellismfgcustomerphotos #construction… https://t.co/yOaHI4CmRs&quot;

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jsharr Maillot Jaune

jsharr ★

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So the building was built on reclaimed wetland.  Has been sinking since the 1990s when it was going down 2mm per year.  I am thinking that it was under a ton of internal stress and something snapped and the whole thing came down.

https://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-miami-condo-sinking-earth-181026431.html

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Kzoo Flahute

Kzoo

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7 minutes ago, jsharr said:

So the building was built on reclaimed wetland.  Has been sinking since the 1990s when it was going down 2mm per year.  I am thinking that it was under a ton of internal stress and something snapped and the whole thing came down.

https://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-miami-condo-sinking-earth-181026431.html

A whole bunch of lawyers are going to make a whole lot of money.

 

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Bikeguy Domestique

Bikeguy

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6 hours ago, Thaddeus Kosciuszko said:

I'd suspect a sinkhole...

That was my first guess..    The talking heads on TV already have explained how that was not the cause.  Not sure how they know that...  :scratchhead:

Then I moved on to the time of the collapse, 1:30 AM.    I'm now guessing..  some drunk drove into an underground parking garage and hit a support column. 

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Ralphie Maillot Jaune

Ralphie ★

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36 minutes ago, Bikeguy said:

That was my first guess..    The talking heads on TV already have explained how that was not the cause.  Not sure how they know that...  :scratchhead:

Then I moved on to the time of the collapse, 1:30 AM.    I'm now guessing..  some drunk drove into an underground parking garage and hit a support column. 

Yeah, they said there are supposed to be backup systems to prevent a collapse like this.

I thought I heard 630 am though.  

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Bikeguy Domestique

Bikeguy

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41 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Do they have underground parking in Miami?  Wouldn't that also be underwater???? 

Wow....  just eliminate a good bad guess in less than 20 minutes.

Yeah...  I'd expect water.    The building was slowing sinking... and FL is famous for sink holes.   

Time will tell... 

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MickinMD KOM / QOM

MickinMD ★

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I got up, made breakfast, and began watching TV half-asleep at 6:30 am this morning.

MSNBC was interviewing some safety official from Montgomery County, Maryland who was describing rescue efforts. The discussion implied a local event - maybe the safety guy was in Miami but I was still half asleep and the dead/injured totals seemed too low to be Miami by this morning.

I thought, "Oh no!  Another condo collapse!  is this a terrorist attack," - like when the 2nd plane hit the Twin Towers in NYC we knew it wasn't an accident.

I switched to the local news channels and not a single mention of a condo collapse in Montgomery County.

Slowly, I realized it was Miami and they've still got 99 missing.  I hope a lot were away from home, but the timing of the collapse is bad for that.

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Razors Edge Flahute

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1 hour ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

Apparently they do.

Which makes it seem pretty challenging to both build and maintain, for sure.  I would hope - especially in a fairly old and established building - that folks in Florida know how to build and work on buildings in less than ideal locations.  I also hope that this is not an issue that other buildings might also have in that area or of the era.

image.png.b3aca813a716070caf9177c0b60ccac6.png

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Prophet Zacharia KOM / QOM

Prophet Zacharia

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37 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Which makes it seem pretty challenging to both build and maintain, for sure.  I would hope - especially in a fairly old and established building - that folks in Florida know how to build and work on buildings in less than ideal locations.  I also hope that this is not an issue that other buildings might also have in that area or of the era.

image.png.b3aca813a716070caf9177c0b60ccac6.png

It’s (was) a fairly new building at only 40 years old. I would Imagine much of the Miami area has much older buildings of similar and taller heights.

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