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Vaccination & parents


shootingstar
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So dear sis-doctor is tired of hearing crap about anti-vaxers.

***Then there are interesting vaccination clinic scenes.  She actually enjoys working at the vaccination clinics.  (Right now, alot of them have closed.)  There is anxiety among certain folks. Children a certain age group abit past kindergarten onward..  She had a 16 yr. girl who was very anxious and crying. It was quite a scene. Her father was there.  There was no story told in advance about any "trauma" experience.   So anyway, patient given to another immunizer.  Sister does understand about needle anxiety because her son right now has it.

After the girl got her vaccination, her father was stroking her hair, talking to her gently etc.  Really, in the eyes of my sister (who is a parent of 2 children, girl and boy   -- 14 yrs. & 11 yrs.), thought the father was overdoing the comforting thing, post-needle.  She hadn't encountered a parent like that to their teen child before. More like treating a 5 yr. old.  She found it puzzling he kept comforting her  10 min. later ....after needle was poked.

Anyway, this clinic is in a heavily Jewish neighbourhood in Toronto, blend of middle income to low income. And the immunizer said to sis, after sis congratulated him for successful vaccination:  "Some Jewish parents enable too much.  I can say this ....'cause I'm Jewish."

 Every family has different ways of handling this.  I'm not keen on needles, getting blood drawn. My anxiety is probably abit more than other family members.  I just bear with it. Worse things could happen to me.  I do have memory....as a 4 yr.old screaming, when I got my polio shot.

 

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I find it difficult to understand the needle aversion/ phobia that some people have. I read stories where people don’t get the vaccine because they fear needles. Have they seen someone intubated? I’d rather get the shot. Let’s talk colonoscopies; I’d rather get the shot. I’m not a fan of needles myself but I’ve donated blood close to 100 times because the inconvenience that I bear is less than what the recipients bear, whatever they are going through. 

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24 minutes ago, Old No. 7 said:

Let’s talk colonoscopies;

:whistle:  Alot of us will end up getting one. And one should get anaethesia.  I did. I was completely ditto/out at the time.  I've only donated blood twice in my life. I'm a bit small and have been anaemic /low in iron at different times in life. Maybe not now. 

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2 hours ago, Old No. 7 said:

I find it difficult to understand the needle aversion/ phobia that some people have. I read stories where people don’t get the vaccine because they fear needles. Have they seen someone intubated? I’d rather get the shot. Let’s talk colonoscopies; I’d rather get the shot. I’m not a fan of needles myself but I’ve donated blood close to 100 times because the inconvenience that I bear is less than what the recipients bear, whatever they are going through. 

Not all physicians or others want to even intubate a patient.  

Usually when child puts up a struggle, tears, sis-doc will speak to parent on the side. She wants the parent to state unequivocally whether or not, they want to still have their child innoculated.

The 16 yr. teen was a highly public crying, loud scene..father was just there and sis could not sit aside with him to speak/ask.  

So what is this child going to be like when she's 21?  For women, she has barely experienced.... physical pain in life. Think of what a woman does experience..

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10 minutes ago, Old No. 7 said:

I find it difficult to understand the needle aversion/ phobia that some people have. I read stories where people don’t get the vaccine because they fear needles. Have they seen someone intubated? I’d rather get the shot. Let’s talk colonoscopies; I’d rather get the shot. I’m not a fan of needles myself but I’ve donated blood close to 100 times because the inconvenience that I bear is less than what the recipients bear, whatever they are going through. 

The fear is real, I have it and many many times in my life have passed out after a blood draw. I still have a driver when I go every quarter as I’m freaking no good for several hours after.  

But I have been up to elbows in other people’s blood and have had my hands literally inside of people trying to stem arterial bleeding. Dead bodies, trauma & such doesn’t bother me.    Needles just  freaking Jack me up.

But having said all that, I sucked it up & got vaccinated…

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18 minutes ago, ChrisL said:

The fear is real, I have it and many many times in my life have passed out after a blood draw. I still have a driver when I go every quarter as I’m freaking no good for several hours after.  

But I have been up to elbows in other people’s blood and have had my hands literally inside of people trying to stem arterial bleeding. Dead bodies, trauma & such doesn’t bother me.    Needles just  freaking Jack me up.

But having said all that, I sucked it up & got vaccinated…

My last blood draw by a technician was very good. I felt nothing after she pumped in 3 vials of blood for the lab.  I complimented her.  I think people like her need compliments.

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3 minutes ago, shootingstar said:

My last blood draw by a technician was very good. I felt nothing after she pumped in 3 vials of blood for the lab.  I complimented her.  I think people like her need compliments.

Yeah I do as well. I always lie down and let the phlebotomist know get woozy.  What I don’t tell them is if they have to hunt for the vein I’ll go down for the count.

i always engage them in discussion to as talking keeps my mind off what’s happening.

 

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2 minutes ago, ChrisL said:

The fear is real, I have it and many many times in my life have passed out after a blood draw. I still have a driver when I go every quarter as I’m freaking no good for several hours after.  

But I have been up to elbows in other people’s blood and have had my hands literally inside of people trying to stem arterial bleeding. Dead bodies, trauma & such doesn’t bother me.    Needles just  freaking Jack me up.

But having said all that, I sucked it up & got vaccinated…

I understand the phobia, but that’s exactly how I see it, a phobia. Like fear of snakes or spiders. It isn’t rational but that is just how some people are. I’m not a fan of needles myself, but I can rationalize it as something bigger than me. No issues anymore; it’s an inconvenience. I met a recipient for one of my donations once. I helped save her life during childbirth. I met the son she bore and those memories keep me donating. Over ten gallons; eight sticks per gallon. I’ve had phlebotomists refer to my veins as highways and sewer pipes ( I didn’t care for that analogy but she was referring to the size of my veins.)

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4 minutes ago, Old No. 7 said:

I understand the phobia, but that’s exactly how I see it, a phobia. Like fear of snakes or spiders. It isn’t rational but that is just how some people are. I’m not a fan of needles myself, but I can rationalize it as something bigger than me. No issues anymore; it’s an inconvenience. I met a recipient for one of my donations once. I helped save her life during childbirth. I met the son she bore and those memories keep me donating. Over ten gallons; eight sticks per gallon. I’ve had phlebotomists refer to my veins as highways and sewer pipes ( I didn’t care for that analogy but she was referring to the size of my veins.)

Yeah but some people cant. To be honest I have been putting off a colonoscopy. I’m not worried about the tube up my keister, it’s the IV. Who was it here that did it without anesthesia? I’d rather do that then have them stick an IV in me.  The last time I had one I was down for the count…

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12 hours ago, ChrisL said:

Yeah but some people cant. To be honest I have been putting off a colonoscopy. I’m not worried about the tube up my keister, it’s the IV. Who was it here that did it without anesthesia? I’d rather do that then have them stick an IV in me.  The last time I had one I was down for the count…

Yeah - I'm fine giving blood as long as I don't look at the needle in my arm or the blood going into the bag- at any point.  If I do, I get lightheaded.  Totally irrational, but I don't like seeing it.

What is for sure is that today's needles are a BAZILLION times better than the needles we had as kids.  You don't even feel shots anymore.  I literally DO NOT FEEL a shot like the COVID vaccine.  One second they are wiping the skin, then pressure in the area, and then done. No feel of the skin getting punctured or the like.  Definitely an improvement.  Even the novacaine shots a dentist will give are WAY better.  You still feel them, and they do that wiggling to the gum, but so much better than decades ago.

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13 hours ago, Old No. 7 said:

I find it difficult to understand the needle aversion/ phobia that some people have.

I am afraid of needles, I don't understand how anyone in their right mind isn't afraid of needles.  They are sharp and pointy and hurty and someone of dubious qualifications is stabbing you with it and will probably break it off in your arm in three places.

That said, I quash the outward expression of this aversion and just get the damn shot/blood draw/novacaine/etc.   But I understand the needle-averse part of it.

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If you have not dealt with a child with massive anxiety over needles, really hard to judge.  My oldest had to be held down by multiple adults in order to get a shot.  We had to hold him so hard and he fought so hard that it left bruises.   Do not judge what you do not understand.   

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13 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

I am afraid of needles, I don't understand how anyone in their right mind isn't afraid of needles.  They are sharp and pointy and hurty and someone of dubious qualifications is stabbing you with it and will probably break it off in your arm in three places.

That said, I quash the outward expression of this aversion and just get the damn shot/blood draw/novacaine/etc.   But I understand the needle-averse part of it.

How does RO handle needles and vaccine shots?  She should be the litmus test - are you a tougher than a 6/7/8 yr old?

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15 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

How does RO handle needles and vaccine shots?  She should be the litmus test - are you a tougher than a 6/7/8 yr old?

I did mention that I quash outward expression of this.  Also in getting hurt, I always act as if that is no big deal around her, I don't want her to pick up hyper drama syndrome if I can help it.

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Just now, Randomguy said:

I did mention that I quash outward expression of this.  Also in getting hurt, I always act as if that is no big deal around her, I don't want her to pick up hyper drama syndrome if I can help it.

Your dad or mom let you down in that regard????  Or is "hyper drama syndrome" a recessive gene and not a learned behavior?

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2 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Your dad or mom let you down in that regard????  Or is "hyper drama syndrome" a recessive gene and not a learned behavior?

My parents never let on that minor injuries were life-changing drama-filled events.  "Oh, you got a cut.  It'll heal if we wash it out."  RO's mom, on the other hand, will go on for hours on how she will be alright, should we go to the doctor, buys her toys, blah blah blah.  Hyper drama for no reason.

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7 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

I did mention that I quash outward expression of this.  Also in getting hurt, I always act as if that is no big deal around her, I don't want her to pick up hyper drama syndrome if I can help it.

I had a saying when the kids were little, no blood no boo hoo.  Exceptions were made for broken bones & really hard falls & such but when it was just a little scrape I said it.  

I agree though that the kid reacts more to the parent than the fall or bump. More often than not I was like, are you ok? OK get up, walk it off let’s go and off they went with no drama.

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Just now, ChrisL said:

I had a saying when the kids were little, no blood no boo hoo.  Exceptions were made for broken bones & really hard falls & such but when it was just a little scrape I said it.  

I agree though that the kid reacts more to the parent than the fall or bump. More often than not I was like, are you ok? OK get up, walk it off let’s go and off they went with no drama.

My kid is not scared of blood or gore.  He has seen plenty of both.  Been burned pretty good when a candle caught his sweat shirt on fire., Split his face open jumping on a tramp, ripped a gash through his lip and loosened two teeth.  Disclocated his elbow and had the bones twisted over each other.   He could deal with all that, but the thought of needle going into his body and injecting a fluid sends him over the edge.   He had to have a sedative in order to get the elbow shot up and numbed so that they could reset it.   I cannot explain it, but I can sympathize with his fear.  

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9 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

My parents never let on that minor injuries were life-changing drama-filled events.  "Oh, you got a cut.  It'll heal if we wash it out."  RO's mom, on the other hand, will go on for hours on how she will be alright, should we go to the doctor, buys her toys, blah blah blah.  Hyper drama for no reason.

When my daughter was 5 she was playing soccer and got kicked just above the shin pad. The cleat cut her and she was bleeding a little.  

So they stop play, she comes off the field and I’m breaking out the 1st aid kit (I’m also the coach).  As I’m digging out the kit I hear a mom say honey don’t do that, you’ll get dirt in your cut.  I look up to see my daughter rubbing the cut in the grass & says “but blood helps the grass grow”.  Oh damn I better stop saying that one…

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1 minute ago, jsharr said:

My kid is not scared of blood or gore.  He has seen plenty of both.  Been burned pretty good when a candle caught his sweat shirt on fire., Split his face open jumping on a tramp, ripped a gash through his lip and loosened two teeth.  Disclocated his elbow and had the bones twisted over each other.   He could deal with all that, but the thought of needle going into his body and injecting a fluid sends him over the edge.   He had to have a sedative in order to get the elbow shot up and numbed so that they could reset it.   I cannot explain it, but I can sympathize with his fear.  

He sounds just like me… 

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38 minutes ago, jsharr said:

If you have not dealt with a child with massive anxiety over needles, really hard to judge.  My oldest had to be held down by multiple adults in order to get a shot.  We had to hold him so hard and he fought so hard that it left bruises.   Do not judge what you do not understand.   

Not judging anyone, I don’t understand it, that was in my original response. I didn’t like needles as a kid and hated getting shots but not to an extreme like you described. When my son was younger we took him to get a flu shot. We waited in a long line for at least 15 minutes. The whole time he complained and fretted about the shot. The people around us were probably tired of hearing it. After the shot his exact words  were, “that didn’t hurt as much as I wanted it to”. Yeah we know. 

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5 minutes ago, Old No. 7 said:

Not judging anyone, I don’t understand it, that was in my original response. I didn’t like needles as a kid and hated getting shots but not to an extreme like you described. When my son was younger we took him to get a flu shot. We waited in a long line for at least 15 minutes. The whole time he complained and fretted about the shot. The people around us were probably tired of hearing it. After the shot his exact words  were, “that didn’t hurt as much as I wanted it to”. Yeah we know. 

It is not about the pain.  He could care less about pain.  It is something to do with a foreign substance being injected into his body.  

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It makes some new nurse employees nervous that I watch them stick the needle in a vein on the inside of my elbow to do my every-three-month diabetes blood test.

It's never bothered me that I remember and I even made the pharmacist who gave me my first Covid shot wait until I got my phone in position to take better-focused picture than the one I took of me with my sleeve rolled up:

1393884476_20210224Mewithsleeverolled-uowaitedfior1stCOVIDvaccination2_24_21.thumb.jpg.a142219b68a95c7716c5d6cd56a85f72.jpg 20210324_101029_900p.thumb.jpg.1eb1569796f0503df1fb1a5fb7e717aa.jpg

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10 hours ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

What does this mean and how does it relate to the rest of your topic? 
 

But if I wanted an opinion of anti-vaxxers, I’d ask an ED or ICU nurse, not a physician working in vaccine clinics. 

No, Prophet ..it's just dealing with wild rumours among lay folks, that physicians and nurses deal with on front line before ICU!  

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3 hours ago, ChrisL said:

I had a saying when the kids were little, no blood no boo hoo.  Exceptions were made for broken bones & really hard falls & such but when it was just a little scrape I said it.  

I agree though that the kid reacts more to the parent than the fall or bump. More often than not I was like, are you ok? OK get up, walk it off let’s go and off they went with no drama.

I think that's the whole point...it's how much parent will overfuss.  Of course, every parent's style is different. Be empathetic, low-key, but life/the rest of morning/day needs to continue soon if it's not an emergency inducing situation.

And never compare against another sibling's behaviour. That doesn't help. Just fuels other things.

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4 hours ago, Randomguy said:

My parents never let on that minor injuries were life-changing drama-filled events.  "Oh, you got a cut.  It'll heal if we wash it out."  RO's mom, on the other hand, will go on for hours on how she will be alright, should we go to the doctor, buys her toys, blah blah blah.  Hyper drama for no reason.

Can you imagine my parents inviting high drama behaviour for..6 children? Nope.  Kind words and then child was left alone to rest/cry abit and settle down.

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2 hours ago, MickinMD said:

It makes some new nurse employees nervous that I watch them stick the needle in a vein on the inside of my elbow to do my every-three-month diabetes blood test.

It's never bothered me that I remember and I even made the pharmacist who gave me my first Covid shot wait until I got my phone in position to take better-focused picture than the one I took of me with my sleeve rolled up:

1393884476_20210224Mewithsleeverolled-uowaitedfior1stCOVIDvaccination2_24_21.thumb.jpg.a142219b68a95c7716c5d6cd56a85f72.jpg 20210324_101029_900p.thumb.jpg.1eb1569796f0503df1fb1a5fb7e717aa.jpg

Duuude! You trying to make me ill!?!?!?

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So among those with fear of needles. Not judging. I just want to understand. Any idea what my have prompted the fear in the first place? Most dentist officex around here are closed on Fridays or close early. We often do time-consuming work on Fridays so we are out of their hair. Once in a while, they will schedule a patient (usually a child) on a Friday because their screams would stress out every other patient in the building. It also gives the patient a certain level of privacy/dignity retention. Usually, once they are numbed and/or sedated, things calm down, but boy! Getting them to that calm....

 

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28 minutes ago, groupw said:

So among those with fear of needles. Not judging. I just want to understand. Any idea what my have prompted the fear in the first place? Most dentist officex around here are closed on Fridays or close early. We often do time-consuming work on Fridays so we are out of their hair. Once in a while, they will schedule a patient (usually a child) on a Friday because their screams would stress out every other patient in the building. It also gives the patient a certain level of privacy/dignity retention. Usually, once they are numbed and/or sedated, things calm down, but boy! Getting them to that calm....

 

No health care worker was told of what prompted fear..except it was needles.

Did I like it when the dentist poised his needle to freeze my gum area/mouth area for my crown rework...?  No. I paused for 15 sec. and then agreed while shutting my eyes.  I think my dentist is experienced...he also does botox work on the side. I wasn't thrilled that it took almost 2 days for the freezing to go away completely.

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3 hours ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

So is your sister sick of the anti-Vax propaganda, or sick of hearing about people being upset at the antivaxers?

She works bulk of her time as emergency medicine doctor and also family medicine at a hospital. So she gets patients of all kinds..and of course, not know who is vaccinated upon arrival. 

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