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Full Size Pick-up With Manual Transmission?


Razors Edge

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36 minutes ago, Further said:

Just to keep the drift going in circles,

I can do that with my Subaru in the snow.   I've tried and it works just fine... like the video below.   With a manual trans it's easy...  with an auto (like mine) you put it into the manual shift mode, disable the traction control and use second gear.  Then use you gas pedal to steer.

 

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When Ford came out with the 6.7 liter diesel they did away with manual transmissions in the Super Duty trucks.  Not sure about the F150's.  I don't think you can get one in a manual now, but not sure when that went away.  The F150's and Super Duty series all come with 10 speed automatics.  Honestly probably a better transmission than a manual anyway (as far as keeping the motors in their power range and for fuel economy)  

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3 hours ago, Parr8hed said:

10 speed automatics.  Honestly probably a better transmission than a manual anyway (as far as keeping the motors in their power range and for fuel economy)  

Yeah, driving a 5 speed, I can easily see adding a 6th gear as the tall/overdrive gear and not really feeling weird. But the idea of a 10sp manual seems like a bit too much shifting for my liking, and the automatic would surely be able to match engine speed and road speed optimally to stay in the best gear for towing or cruising or accelerating.  Manuals are FUN, and they really help keep drivers ENGAGED in the act of driving, but with 10 sp automatics, it's tough to think they are better in "average" driving situations.  It's tough to own "one car for many needs" and have it be a manual just for the low %age times where you're just blasting around for the hell of it.  The folks with the "spare" Miatas seem to have the idea right - normal cars for normal driving, and the "fun car" for fun driving.

I will say, I have almost always had "cheap" and/or "practical" cars/tucks. All were/are stick except the Accord.  Those cars, though, with the stick, were ALL way more fun to drive than their identical automatic versions. WAY WAY more fun.  If you are going "cheap", stick really seems to have added huge value. 

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55 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Yeah, driving a 5 speed, I can easily see adding a 6th gear as the tall/overdrive gear and not really feeling weird. But the idea of a 10sp manual seems like a bit too much shifting for my liking, and the automatic would surely be able to match engine speed and road speed optimally to stay in the best gear for towing or cruising or accelerating.  Manuals are FUN, and they really help keep drivers ENGAGED in the act of driving, but with 10 sp automatics, it's tough to think they are better in "average" driving situations.  It's tough to own "one car for many needs" and have it be a manual just for the low %age times where you're just blasting around for the hell of it.  The folks with the "spare" Miatas seem to have the idea right - normal cars for normal driving, and the "fun car" for fun driving.

I will say, I have almost always had "cheap" and/or "practical" cars/tucks. All were/are stick except the Accord.  Those cars, though, with the stick, were ALL way more fun to drive than their identical automatic versions. WAY WAY more fun.  If you are going "cheap", stick really seems to have added huge value. 

When I had my accord it was a 6 speed.  You don't always get one gear added on top to make it a tall overdrive.  This one had close to the same final ratio but the gears were just closer.  

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On 11/15/2021 at 4:32 PM, Razors Edge said:

Do they exist anymore?  Was thinking I never see them, but maybe in the "work truck" category?  Pretty sure classic style Jeeps can still be bought with them, but darn, it's sort of nuts if "trucks" can't.

Why would anyone want a manual transmission these days?

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40 minutes ago, Parr8hed said:

When I had my accord it was a 6 speed.  You don't always get one gear added on top to make it a tall overdrive.  This one had close to the same final ratio but the gears were just closer.  

This.  Same with bikes. 8 speed or 11 speed cogs. Usually same (or close) high and low ends, just closer gears. Makes it easier on the legs. Or the engine. 

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40 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

Why would anyone want a manual transmission these days?

I feel like it offers more control in a pickup truck when pulling a load or weighted down.  You can downshift easier to control weight going downhill.  Can hold it in lower gears longer to climb or start.  But of course the economy offered these days kinda offsets that.  Also more heavy trucks come equipped with exhaust brakes from the factory these days.  Certainly makes descending gradients easier with a load.  

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56 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

They are much more fun to drive when NOT in traffic.

WRONG!  Manual transmissions are literally never fun to drive.  There is something very wrong with your brain if you think they are fun beyond some momentary fantasy.

24 minutes ago, Parr8hed said:

I feel like it offers more control in a pickup truck when pulling a load or weighted down.  You can downshift easier to control weight going downhill.  Can hold it in lower gears longer to climb or start.  But of course the economy offered these days kinda offsets that.  Also more heavy trucks come equipped with exhaust brakes from the factory these days.  Certainly makes descending gradients easier with a load.  

Ok, in this scenario, you make a case that you feel like it offers an advantage or two.  Stacked against all the massive disadvantages, I think most people would have to be fighting the truck on all downhills or would want to have it in lower gears to climb and start all the damn time to make it worthwhile.

I see most dunderheads expressing the sadness that they don't have manual transmission, and it is 99.99999% false, misplaced, and invented nostalgia.  They imply some sort of manliness or craftiness or unique know-how that only comes from having a manual transmission, and it is bullshit, just more layers of crap to get in the way of actual real world utility of the clearly vastly superior automatic transmission almost every normal everyday situation.  Sure, there may be some specific instances or beyond-ordinary circumstances where there are benefits (perceived or otherwise), but there is a very good reason they are getting harder to find.  That reason is that they are simply not necessary for almost all drivers, and also serve as a distraction or deterrent to safe driving.  So basically, they are stupid at this point in time for almost all drivers.

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4 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

WRONG!  Manual transmissions are literally never fun to drive.  There is something very wrong with your brain if you think they are fun beyond some momentary fantasy.

Well, the caveat is that the driver must have an iota of coordination.  For the uncoordinated, yes, stick shifts are a nightmare. Sorry you're all thumbs :(

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1 minute ago, Zealot said:

They are actually fun to drive in traffic too, in my opinion.  But agreed, lots of fun outside of traffic.  😊 

In MOVING traffic and the right car, yes. Actually lots of fun.  But in normal DC's Beltway dead stop -> mad scramble -> dead stop -> insane aggression -> dead stop mess, it is less fun :(  

We had a CRX that was a freaking go-cart.  And, normally that was my wife's car, but I would sometimes drive it to work - in Beltway traffic - and if the traffic was at least moving, I could zip in and out of tiny gaps in the traffic.  Sure, it was a tiny little tin can, but damn it was fun - even in traffic.  But a ton more fun just on twisty little roads or even short runs to the store.  Not much power, but also not much weight.

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12 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

WRONG!  Manual transmissions are literally never fun to drive.  There is something very wrong with your brain if you think they are fun beyond some momentary fantasy.

Ok, in this scenario, you make a case that you feel like it offers an advantage or two.  Stacked against all the massive disadvantages, I think most people would have to be fighting the truck on all downhills or would want to have it in lower gears to climb and start all the damn time to make it worthwhile.

I see most dunderheads expressing the sadness that they don't have manual transmission, and it is 99.99999% false, misplaced, and invented nostalgia.  They imply some sort of manliness or craftiness or unique know-how that only comes from having a manual transmission, and it is bullshit, just more layers of crap to get in the way of actual real world utility of the clearly vastly superior automatic transmission almost every normal everyday situation.  Sure, there may be some specific instances or beyond-ordinary circumstances where there are benefits (perceived or otherwise), but there is a very good reason they are getting harder to find.  That reason is that they are simply not necessary for almost all drivers, and also serve as a distraction or deterrent to safe driving.  So basically, they are stupid at this point in time for almost all drivers.

I will agree with that.

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Just now, Razors Edge said:

In MOVING traffic and the right car, yes. Actually lots of fun.  But in normal DC's Beltway dead stop -> mad scramble -> dead stop -> insane aggression -> dead stop mess, it is less fun :(  

We had a CRX that was a freaking go-cart.  And, normally that was my wife's car, but I would sometimes drive it to work - in Beltway traffic - and if the traffic was at least moving, I could zip in and out of tiny gaps in the traffic.  Sure, it was a tiny little tin can, but damn it was fun - even in traffic.  But a ton more fun just on twisty little roads or even short runs to the store.  Not much power, but also not much weight.

I feel your pain! Drove manuals for most of the 9 years I lived in DC and for 12 years commuting from where I live now to DC daily. 95 mile one way trip. 270, 495, GW Parkway, 395, SE/SW Freeway, 295. 😊  Yes, stop and go traffic gets very tedious. And today that has spread to all the major corridors leading in. 

But, still prefer a stick.  And I agree, the small cars are fun to maneuver through the mess.  😊 

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47 minutes ago, Parr8hed said:

I feel like it offers more control in a pickup truck when pulling a load or weighted down.  You can downshift easier to control weight going downhill.  Can hold it in lower gears longer to climb or start.  But of course the economy offered these days kinda offsets that.  Also more heavy trucks come equipped with exhaust brakes from the factory these days.  Certainly makes descending gradients easier with a load.  

Main reasons we've stayed with manual transmissions. When we bought our dodge 2500 a neighbor bought one with an automatic. He indicated he still had to shift it manually when hauling trailer loads of livestock to maintain his speed on hills. Needless to say, I much prefer a manual in the 3500. Mainly use the truck when hauling loads or the pu camper. We don't normally use it as a car. 

I think someone pissed on RG's cereal. He must have gotten too close to 'that' female rockstar.:whistle:

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3 minutes ago, sheep_herder said:

Main reasons we've stayed with manual transmissions. When we bought our dodge 2500 a neighbor bought one with an automatic. He indicated he still had to shift it manually when hauling trailer loads of livestock to maintain his speed on hills. Needless to say, I much prefer a manual in the 3500.

My F350 sorta sucks in the transmission dept.  It is a 6 speed auto.  So it doesn't get near the economy of the newer 10 speeds.  It's not new enough to have an exhaust brake (from the factory anyways) but it's too new to have a manual tranny.  It just kinda sucks all the way around.  But for what I use it for it does fine.  The f150 is automatic as well, but I am fine with that one being auto especially since I don't tow or haul with it anymore.  

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1 minute ago, Parr8hed said:

My F350 sorta sucks in the transmission dept.  It is a 6 speed auto.  So it doesn't get near the economy of the newer 10 speeds.  It's not new enough to have an exhaust brake (from the factory anyways) but it's too new to have a manual tranny.  It just kinda sucks all the way around.  But for what I use it for it does fine.  The f150 is automatic as well, but I am fine with that one being auto especially since I don't tow or haul with it anymore.  

Exhaust brakes (Jake Brakes) are outlawed in a lot of towns out west. I still hear some on the interstates.

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2 minutes ago, sheep_herder said:

Exhaust brakes (Jake Brakes) are outlawed in a lot of towns out west. I still hear some on the interstates.

https://us.bddiesel.com/products/6-7l-powerstroke-exhaust-brake-ford-2011-2014-f250-f350?variant=30073909739584

I guess I could add one on if I felt so inclined. Honestly the camper doesn't make that truck sweat at all.  I don't thing it needs anything.  Stops fine.  

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Just now, sheep_herder said:

Don't plan on selling my diesel '97 Dodge 3500 any time soon, but apparently two of this same model have been stolen recently. The Dodge place locked mine up in the shop last Friday night rather than park it on the street.

HD diesels are really going for a premium these days.  

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8 minutes ago, Parr8hed said:

My F350 sorta sucks in the transmission dept.  It is a 6 speed auto.  So it doesn't get near the economy of the newer 10 speeds.  It's not new enough to have an exhaust brake (from the factory anyways) but it's too new to have a manual tranny.  It just kinda sucks all the way around.  But for what I use it for it does fine.  The f150 is automatic as well, but I am fine with that one being auto especially since I don't tow or haul with it anymore.  

Our Ram has exhaust braking. I like it. But no manual. 

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