Uber self-driving car kills cyclist, and Weapons of Math Destruction

[shootingstar]

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2018/03/19/uber-self-driving-vehicle-hits-kills-pedestrian-in-phoenix-suburb.html  It turns me cold to think of Uber self-driving cars test driving in Toronto..The Arizona cyclist was actually walking her bike, when she was struck. I don't get it ..where was the person that was supposed to grab control the car. 

Anyway am reading about Weapons of Math Destruction.  In a way, that's what self-driving cars are ....full of complex alogrithms (created by imperfect human beings) to recognize certain lines, shapes, movements..spatial relationships in dynamic environment.  

I like how the author wrote, a former mathematician with PhD who left academia and joined a private sector firm that had hedge funds before she left.  She writes simply with a good examples to introduce every person to the world of artificial intelligence, alogorimths and machine learning.  

From book a (mathematical) model is an opinion.  She said it so well.

I bought the paperback book to read it.  It will become a classic for years to come for the general public on artificial intelligence and danger of not truly understanding automated results nor asking origin. Sadly it's gonna to take mathematicians to decode harmful (or flawed) mathematical models. 

 

 

[LabDaddy]

I'd rather be surrounded by self-driving cars than human-driving cars.

 

[maddmaxx ★]

Robots are the wave of the future.  You will be assimilated.

[Ralphie ★]

4 hours ago, LabDaddy said:

I'd rather be surrounded by self-driving cars than human-driving cars.

 

I'm afraid so.  It doesn't make the news when a human does something dumb like that. It's just another day.

[pedalphile]

6 hours ago, LabDaddy said:

I'd rather be surrounded by self-driving cars than human-driving cars.

 

I would prefer not being surrounded with cars, full stop.

[Longjohn ★]

Horses can be dangerous too. They have a mind of their own.

[Kzoo]

How many pedestrians were hit and killed the same day by non-self driving cars. 

“I don't get it ..where was the person that was supposed to grab control the car.”

[The_Karen_Cooper_Incident]

Car of Peace. 

Couch 

[shootingstar]

3 hours ago, RalphWaldoMooseworth said:

I'm afraid so.  It doesn't make the news when a human does something dumb like that. It's just another day.

Sadly so true. 

How the Netherlands did it, was to always have car drivers prove they weren't responsible. Their car-truck legislation is completely different.  We had a Dutch transportation specialist visit our city to present several yrs. ago.

I'm waiting for a good friend to answer my questions.  She works for provincial Ontario Ministry of Transportation who originally wanted to test these cars in Toronto.. On the policy side for a long time, but in other different issues. 

[LabDaddy]

https://www.sfchronicle.com/business/article/Exclusive-Tempe-police-chief-says-early-probe-12765481.php#photo-15257361

"Pushing a bicycle laden with plastic shopping bags, a woman abruptly walked from a center median into a lane of traffic..."

"From viewing the videos, “it’s very clear it would have been difficult to avoid this collision in any kind of mode (autonomous or human-driven) based on how she came from the shadows right into the roadway,” Moir said. The police have not released the videos."

 

[Dirtyhip]

This sounds like the bike/ped was doing something very dangerous.  Also, There has been far less accidents of these vehicles than those of people driven cars.  You will never have to worry about self driving cars being impaired or distracted on cell phones.  

10 hours ago, shootingstar said:

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2018/03/19/uber-self-driving-vehicle-hits-kills-pedestrian-in-phoenix-suburb.html  It turns me cold to think of Uber self-driving cars test driving in Toronto..The Arizona cyclist was actually walking her bike, when she was struck. I don't get it ..where was the person that was supposed to grab control the car. 

Anyway am reading about Weapons of Math Destruction.  In a way, that's what self-driving cars are ....full of complex alogrithms (created by imperfect human beings) to recognize certain lines, shapes, movements..spatial relationships in dynamic environment.  

I like how the author wrote, a former mathematician with PhD who left academia and joined a private sector firm that had hedge funds before she left.  She writes simply with a good examples to introduce every person to the world of artificial intelligence, alogorimths and machine learning.  

From book a (mathematical) model is an opinion.  She said it so well.

I bought the paperback book to read it.  It will become a classic for years to come for the general public on artificial intelligence and danger of not truly understanding automated results nor asking origin. Sadly it's gonna to take mathematicians to decode harmful (or flawed) mathematical models. 

 

 

Maybe the "driver" was distracted.  Most likely on a cell phone, would be my guess.

[LabDaddy]

2 minutes ago, Dirtyhip said:

Maybe the "driver" was distracted.  Most likely on a cell phone, would be my guess.

It really sounds like it was unavoidable. 10 at night, overcast, she was walking in the median when she went into the traffic lane.

“The driver said it was like a flash, the person walked out in front of them,” said Sylvia Moir, police chief in Tempe, Ariz., the location for the first pedestrian fatality involving a self-driving car. “His first alert to the collision was the sound of the collision.”

[jsharr ★]

3 hours ago, pedalphile said:

I would prefer not being surrounded with cars, full stop.

If they all stop, you will shirley be surrounded by them still.

[Razors Edge ★]

2 hours ago, Dirtyhip said:

This sounds like the bike/ped was doing something very dangerous.  Also, There has been far less accidents of these vehicles than those of people driven cars.  You will never have to worry about self driving cars being impaired or distracted on cell phones.  

Maybe the "driver" was distracted.  Most likely on a cell phone, would be my guess.

Humans with vehicles are involved in ~30,000 deaths a year in the US, and we drive 3.2 TRILLION miles. That's like one death per 100 MILLION miles driven.  Wow. That is actually quite shocking to me.

I wonder if the Uber cars have hit 100 million miles for a year yet? 

In any case, I think that person with a bike might have died regardless the type of driver  but I'm with Peds in that the fewer cars vehicles, the better, but good luck getting Americans on board with that goal.

Tom

Edited March 20, 2018 by Razors Edge
fixed for LJ!

[pedalphile]

27 minutes ago, jsharr said:

If they all stop, you will shirley be surrounded by them still.

There are cities of relatively few cars, bicycle cities they call them, the people of the Low Countries for example, they have them.

[jsharr ★]

1 minute ago, pedalphile said:

There are cities of relatively few cars, bicycle cities they call them, the people of the Low Countries for example, they have them.

 

 

[pedalphile]

I thought Garth Crookes was a soccerista?

[Razors Edge ★]

5 minutes ago, pedalphile said:

I thought Garth Crookes was a soccerista?

I doubt that, but his daughter is F-U-N!

Tom

[Longjohn ★]

35 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

the fewer cars, the better, but good luck getting Americans on board with that goal.

There are very few cars in my area, everyone drives either a truck or a horse and buggy. My wife and I are the exception. We have a van and an SUV. 

[jsharr ★]

45 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Humans with vehicles are involved in ~30,000 deaths a year in the US, and we drive 3.2 TRILLION miles. That's like one death per 100 MILLION miles driven.  Wow. That is actually quite shocking to me.

I wonder if the Uber cars have hit 100 million miles for a year yet? 

In any case, I think that person with a bike might have died regardless the type of driver  but I'm with Peds in that the fewer cars vehicles, the better, but good luck getting Americans on board with that goal.

Tom

Cool chart.  I like the way you can see trends.  During World War Two, the deaths dropped.  In the horsepower wars of the 60s, the death rate climbed and has dropped ever since that ended and technology in cars got better, esp crash protection and crash avoidance.  

[Razors Edge ★]

12 minutes ago, jsharr said:

Cool chart.  I like the way you can see trends.  During World War Two, the deaths dropped.  In the horsepower wars of the 60s, the death rate climbed and has dropped ever since that ended and technology in cars got better, esp crash protection and crash avoidance.  

The opposite trends seem to be true about pedestrians.  They are getting killed at increasing rates:

Five states — California, Florida, Texas, New York and Arizona — accounted for 43 percent of pedestrian deaths during the first half of 2017, despite being home to just 30 percent of the U.S. population.

Last year, NPR's Laurel Wamsley reported on a study that identified the most dangerous cities for pedestrians. Eight of the top 10 most dangerous areas were in Florida, according to the study by Smart Growth America. And people of color are disproportionately affected by the hazards, as Laurel reported:

"People of color are over-represented among those pedestrians killed. Non-white people are 34.9 percent of the U.S. population, but make up 46.1 percent of pedestrian deaths.

"In certain places, this disparity is especially stark. In North Dakota, Native Americans are 5 percent of the population, but account for nearly 38 percent of pedestrian deaths."

Tom

[jsharr ★]

2 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

The opposite trends seem to be true about pedestrians.  They are getting killed at increasing rates:

Five states — California, Florida, Texas, New York and Arizona — accounted for 43 percent of pedestrian deaths during the first half of 2017, despite being home to just 30 percent of the U.S. population.

Last year, NPR's Laurel Wamsley reported on a study that identified the most dangerous cities for pedestrians. Eight of the top 10 most dangerous areas were in Florida, according to the study by Smart Growth America. And people of color are disproportionately affected by the hazards, as Laurel reported:

"People of color are over-represented among those pedestrians killed. Non-white people are 34.9 percent of the U.S. population, but make up 46.1 percent of pedestrian deaths.

"In certain places, this disparity is especially stark. In North Dakota, Native Americans are 5 percent of the population, but account for nearly 38 percent of pedestrian deaths."

Tom

I do not like this one at all.  People walking and texting mixed with people driving and texting 

[MickinMD ★]

6 hours ago, maddmaxx said:

Robots are the wave of the future.  You will be assimilated.

Our only hope is that organic tissue will prove to be most efficient and will be integrated with robotic functions.

In other words, WE will become the Borg of Star Trek and realize your quote, to which I add: Resistance is futile!

 

[Razors Edge ★]

Just now, jsharr said:

I do not like this one at all.  People walking and texting mixed with people driving and texting 

Seems like from figure 6, and the linked articles, it is ALCOHOL to blame, and old folks & children are also a big target.

Tom

[jsharr ★]

Just now, Razors Edge said:

Seems like from figure 6, and the linked articles, it is ALCOHOL to blame, and old folks & children are also a big target.

Tom

Agreed, but overall, we (Americans) are a very self absorbed and distracted lot of asshats and trends like this will continue.  Studies I have read show that the impairment from texting can rival that of alcohol.

[Razors Edge ★]

19 minutes ago, jsharr said:

Agreed, but overall, we (Americans) are a very self absorbed and distracted lot of asshats and trends like this will continue.  Studies I have read show that the impairment from texting can rival that of alcohol.

...and crying babies, and eating McDonalds, and changing the radio station, and being sleepy, and ...

The real challenge is our two ton metal suits of armor are becoming very safe to the folks INSIDE them but increasingly dangerous to those OUTSIDE them.  That "total traffic fatalities" (table 1) number is the one we need to move WAY down.

Tom

[jsharr ★]

10 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

...and crying babies, and eating McDonalds, and changing the radio station, and being sleepy, and ...

The real challenge is our two ton metal suits of armor are becoming very safe to the folks INSIDE them but increasingly dangerous to those OUTSIDE them.  That "total traffic fatalities" (table 1) number is the one we need to move WAY down.

Tom

The machines in and of themselves are not more dangerous, in fact, some are less dangerous, but the way we choose to operate them is.  I have to conciously remind myself I am driving, and make an effort to disconnect from technology and just drive.

I do not text when I drive.  I ask my boys or wife to look at my phone if needed and to input navigation queries, etc.  If I take a call when driving, it is hands free.  I use the wheel mounted controls to take the call or to change the radio station, etc. 

Many vehicles now have sensor packages that help to alert the driver to vehicles in the blind spots, to maintain lane position, safe following distance etc all of which have the potential to make them safer to all.

 

[LabDaddy]

Just now, jsharr said:

Many vehicles now have sensor packages that help to ... maintain ... safe following distance

I'm waiting for adaptive cruise control on bikes.

 

 

[jsharr ★]

5 minutes ago, LabDaddy said:

I'm waiting for adaptive cruise control on bikes.

 

 

Most have it, you just have to leave the bike on the car carrier to activate it.

[12string]

3 hours ago, jsharr said:

If I take a call when driving, it is hands free. 

A cause of mine: Just so you know Every study ever done on this has proven that hands free makes no difference, the driver is equally distracted hands free or hand held.  They have also found that the drivers generally are not aware of their level of distraction until the scene is replayed to them without the phone. 

But self driving cars use cellular connections to navigate, so aren't they by definition ALWAYS on the phone?!?!?!

[pedalphile]

4 minutes ago, 12string said:

A cause of mine: Just so you know Every study ever done on this has proven that hands free makes no difference, the driver is equally distracted hands free or hand held.  They have also found that the drivers generally are not aware of their level of distraction until the scene is replayed to them without the phone. 

But self driving cars use cellular connections to navigate, so aren't they by definition ALWAYS on the phone?!?!?!

Very well put, and I’m glad for a change I read to the bottom before replying, as my point is the same one, even hands free is not safe, the mental distraction is still huge.

[Razors Edge ★]

An interesting perspective and timely:

------------------------------

Take action to require automated vehicles to see bicyclists and pedestrians - by Caron Whitaker

On Sunday night, an autonomous vehicle operated by Uber hit and killed a pedestrian in Tempe, AZ, as she was walking her bicycle across the street. While the details of the crash are still forthcoming, the League of American Bicyclists is concerned that these vehicles are being deployed without having to first prove their ability to recognize and respond to people biking and walking in our streets.

This tragedy marks the first time a bicyclist or pedestrian has been killed by an automated vehicle in the United States. However, recent articles in IEEE Spectrum and in Slate magazine report that detecting bicyclists is one most difficult problems Automated Driving Systems (ADS) technology faces and testing for bicyclists lags behind other ADS technology tests. This tragedy shows that not all manufacturers’ technology is ready to be tested in communities.

When human drivers apply for a driver’s license we have to pass a vision test. The League believes that all automated driving systems should first have to pass a “vision test” as well — requiring a safety performance standard — proving their ability to recognize and respond to people bicycling and walking, before they are on community streets.

Right now the Senate is considering S. 1885: AV START Act to set guidelines for automated vehicle manufacturers to test their vehicles on our streets. Please join the League in asking Senators to require AVs to pass a vision test.

------------------------------

Tom

[Reverend_Maynard]

16 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

An interesting perspective and timely:

------------------------------

Take action to require automated vehicles to see bicyclists and pedestrians - by Caron Whitaker

On Sunday night, an autonomous vehicle operated by Uber hit and killed a pedestrian in Tempe, AZ, as she was walking her bicycle across the street. While the details of the crash are still forthcoming, the League of American Bicyclists is concerned that these vehicles are being deployed without having to first prove their ability to recognize and respond to people biking and walking in our streets.

This tragedy marks the first time a bicyclist or pedestrian has been killed by an automated vehicle in the United States. However, recent articles in IEEE Spectrum and in Slate magazine report that detecting bicyclists is one most difficult problems Automated Driving Systems (ADS) technology faces and testing for bicyclists lags behind other ADS technology tests. This tragedy shows that not all manufacturers’ technology is ready to be tested in communities.

When human drivers apply for a driver’s license we have to pass a vision test. The League believes that all automated driving systems should first have to pass a “vision test” as well — requiring a safety performance standard — proving their ability to recognize and respond to people bicycling and walking, before they are on community streets.

Right now the Senate is considering S. 1885: AV START Act to set guidelines for automated vehicle manufacturers to test their vehicles on our streets. Please join the League in asking Senators to require AVs to pass a vision test.

------------------------------

Tom

Typical.  "We don't know any details, but we're sure some piece of legislation would have prevented this."

[donkpow]

We should build more pedestrian bridges and fight back against the assault.

[jsharr ★]

1 hour ago, 12string said:

A cause of mine: Just so you know Every study ever done on this has proven that hands free makes no difference, the driver is equally distracted hands free or hand held.  They have also found that the drivers generally are not aware of their level of distraction until the scene is replayed to them without the phone. 

But self driving cars use cellular connections to navigate, so aren't they by definition ALWAYS on the phone?!?!?!

This makes me sad.  I thought I was doing a good thing.  I also drink my beer hands free while driving by using one of these. 

Is that bad too?
 

[12string]

5 minutes ago, jsharr said:

This makes me sad.  I thought I was doing a good thing.  I also drink my beer hands free while driving by using one of these. 

Is that bad too?
 

TERRIBLE!!! That only leads to drunk dialing old girlfriends while driving!

[jsharr ★]

3 minutes ago, 12string said:

TERRIBLE!!! That only leads to drunk dialing old girlfriends handsfree while driving!

fify.

At least since I am handsfree calling and drinking, I can keep one hand on the wheel.

[jsharr ★]

45 minutes ago, donkpow said:

We should build more pedestrian bridges and fight back against the assault.

[shootingstar]

Keep in mind, the Arizona fatality was a pedestrian fatality...it was a cyclist walking her bike across the road.  

[LabDaddy]

21 minutes ago, shootingstar said:

Keep in mind, the Arizona fatality was a pedestrian fatality...it was a cyclist walking her bike across the road.  

Doesn't matter that she was a cyclist. Just like it doesn't matter that she was a homeless drug addict. It's not relevant.

And she wasn't "walking her bike across the road"; she was walking in the median when she abruptly moved into the lane with oncoming traffic.

 

 

[shootingstar]

6 hours ago, Razors Edge said:

An interesting perspective and timely:

------------------------------

Take action to require automated vehicles to see bicyclists and pedestrians - by Caron Whitaker

On Sunday night, an autonomous vehicle operated by Uber hit and killed a pedestrian in Tempe, AZ, as she was walking her bicycle across the street. While the details of the crash are still forthcoming, the League of American Bicyclists is concerned that these vehicles are being deployed without having to first prove their ability to recognize and respond to people biking and walking in our streets.

This tragedy marks the first time a bicyclist or pedestrian has been killed by an automated vehicle in the United States. However, recent articles in IEEE Spectrum and in Slate magazine report that detecting bicyclists is one most difficult problems Automated Driving Systems (ADS) technology faces and testing for bicyclists lags behind other ADS technology tests. This tragedy shows that not all manufacturers’ technology is ready to be tested in communities.

When human drivers apply for a driver’s license we have to pass a vision test. The League believes that all automated driving systems should first have to pass a “vision test” as well — requiring a safety performance standard — proving their ability to recognize and respond to people bicycling and walking, before they are on community streets.

Right now the Senate is considering S. 1885: AV START Act to set guidelines for automated vehicle manufacturers to test their vehicles on our streets. Please join the League in asking Senators to require AVs to pass a vision test.

------------------------------

Tom

Thx Razor for this.