Adding a 30T cog to my cassette

[Louielouie-FP3]

Hello Everyone!

Long time no post!

 

I have a very big event coming up next January. It's La Vuelta Puerto Rico, perhaps you've heard of it, www.vueltapr.com . I am a four year veteran of this ride and every year the two big climbs on this event kick my ass!! Now I'm not exactly a small person, at 5'9" and 205lbs and a 34 inch waist I'm considerd a "clydesdale" in the cycling community. I plan on being around 180lbs by event date!

 

A bit more about this "ride". It's three days and 375 miles, day one is 155 miles, day two is 80 miles, and day three is 131 miles. There is a limit of 600 riders and they are split into three groups. Group A is for the hammerheads and world class cyclists, they AVERAGE 25+mph for the ENTIRE ride. Group B averages 20-25mph for the ENTIRE ride, and Group C averages 15-20mph for the ENTIRE ride. I train for Group A but I ride in C!

 

Now, about these 2 nasty climbs:

Climb One comes at mile 92 of day one! You will go from 32 feet in elevation to a little over 600 feet in about 1.25 miles with the last pitch at well over 15% grade!!

 

Climb Two comes at mile 60 of day three. This one is not as long but you go from around 26 feet to 300 feet in a half mile with the last 200 meters at 21% grade!!

 

Now that you have all the data, here are my questions:

 

Could I add a 30T cog to my 12T-25T cassette by eliminating the 13T cog?

 

Would I have to add more links to my chain which right now has 105 links(yes I counted them all!) and how many?

 

Can the chain make the jump from the 25T to the 30T without issue?

 

I'm thinking of eliminating the 13T cog to make room for the 30T cog so then I would end up with these gears:

 

12, 14, 15, 16, 17, 19, 21, 23, 25, 30, and my 50/34 compact in front.

 

I look forward to your comments!!

 

Regards,

 

Luis

[JerrySTL ★]

Sorry that it took me so long to see this post.

 

You can't easily modify cassettes like the old freewheels back in the day. As far as I know, you can't buy individual gears like back in the day. So you need to buy a complete cassette anyway. Make sure to get a new chain to go with it for two reasons; (1) a new cassette / old chain combination can lead to gear jumping, and (2) you're going to need more links if you get a bigger granny gear - probably 4 or 6.

 

But before you buy anything, what kind of rear derailleur is on the bike? Many road derailleurs can't handle a 30-tooth gear especially if they aren't a long-cage RD.

[Nate]

I can tell you that 28 teeth is the absolute max for a short cage deraillieur and really 27 is the "advertised" limit

 

I have lots of double digit grades here, very similar stuff to the climbs there in Puerto Rico. I used to live there in Ponce on the south side of the island, and the mountains there are a lot like the ridges here. Steep.

 

anyway, I have long cage deraillieurs on my bikes with an oversized rear cassette. You have to change the RD to use a 30 tooth

 

I don't think the 30 to 25 jump is too much. Back in the old days you used to see a big jump to the last gear of a 5 gear cassette

 

definitely get a new chain when you do this, unless you run out of money for the parts and are constrained in to using the old chain. You will have to add links, but it is hard to say how many. I like some slack in the chain, there's less drag, but not everybody agrees with that.

[Longjohn ★]

I changed the cassette on my road bike to one with a thirty tooth.  Then I had to get the long cage derailleur express shipped to me for the hilly century ride that week.  It was an easy change and I love the new cassette.  I bought a cassette that had a bigger sprocket on one side and a smaller one on the other than the ones that were on my bike.  Now I have more top end and better climbing power.

[Longjohn ★]

I wonder what Louie ended up with? Did he crash his bike in the Vielto?

[Razors Edge ★]

On 12/14/2020 at 12:27 AM, Longjohn said:

I wonder what Louie ended up with? Did he crash his bike in the Vielto?

I always wondered if he was an organizer or affiliated in some way to that ride.  He pushed it sort of hard - even over at the old Love Forum.

Funny, though, reading this 2014 question with 2020 hindsight.  Gearing options have changed so much since 2014, and cassettes just get bigger and bigger - especially now with 1x set ups.  SRAM's stuff is nutso, and Shimano looks like they said, "We can be crazy too!". 

One nice thing about even my simple 11sp on my Tarmac is the upgrade from 10sp (12-27 and 50/36 old system) to 11sp (11-28 and 50/34) gave me a greater top end and lower climbing with the same gaps.  Truly great.  My new Diverge has a 48/31 big/small and an 11-32, so I get a better than 1 climbing combo!  Not quite a triple's range, but darn close!

[Longjohn ★]

50 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

I always wondered if he was an organizer or affiliated in some way to that ride.  He pushed it sort of hard - even over at the old Love Forum.

Funny, though, reading this 2014 question with 2020 hindsight.  Gearing options have changed so much since 2014, and cassettes just get bigger and bigger - especially now with 1x set ups.  SRAM's stuff is nutso, and Shimano looks like they said, "We can be crazy too!". 

One nice thing about even my simple 11sp on my Tarmac is the upgrade from 10sp (12-27 and 50/36 old system) to 11sp (11-28 and 50/34) gave me a greater top end and lower climbing with the same gaps.  Truly great.  My new Diverge has a 48/31 big/small and an 11-32, so I get a better than 1 climbing combo!  Not quite a triple's range, but darn close!

I would either have to ride one of those 11X1 or sit down and do some math to figure out how low the bottom gear is for climbing. I’m guessing I’m going to stick with my triples. I was eyeing up a titanium gravel/bike packing  bike online and the only gearing they offered was 11X1. They listed a 11X2 but when you get to the cart to check out it said sold out. I’m not getting any stronger and where I live is all hills. My touring bike is 9X3 and climbs fine, my road bike a 2005 is also 9X3 but I had to change my cassette for a few of the hills they always include in the century rides. 

[Razors Edge ★]

16 hours ago, Longjohn said:

I would either have to ride one of those 11X1 or sit down and do some math to figure out how low the bottom gear is for climbing. I’m guessing I’m going to stick with my triples. I was eyeing up a titanium gravel/bike packing  bike online and the only gearing they offered was 11X1. They listed a 11X2 but when you get to the cart to check out it said sold out. I’m not getting any stronger and where I live is all hills. My touring bike is 9X3 and climbs fine, my road bike a 2005 is also 9X3 but I had to change my cassette for a few of the hills they always include in the century rides. 

A modern 2x is a wonderful thing and I personally would think, if you looked at the current 2x11 gearing (even a 2x12 options now), would be the same or better than a 3x9sp or even a 3x10sp.  My buddy got the same gravel bike as me except his is 1x11 and mine is a 2x11.  He runs out of "top" end when we ride together, but he doesn't have to drop to the little ring like I need to on climbs. 

I'd 100% say don't upgrade any 3x you have, but if you are getting a new bike, a 2x11 or 2x12 would be sweet - especially as you do have hills where you are. 

There is a HUGE shortage in bike components still, so I can see you getting the pushback at check-out (or before) if trying for the planned but unavailable drivetrain.  I've even seen where left shifters are available (just needed for 2x), but right ones are not (right is used by 2x and 1x), so it is a wacky time right now.

[Longjohn ★]

I’m not going to buy anything right now. Not sure what is going on with my wife. In some ways she is doing better than before but some ways are worse. If my health stays ok and my wife passes I’m really considering that titanium gravel bike.

[dinneR ★]

This is a 1x18 with an 11x112t cassette.

Honestly, I miss my singlespeeds. Those bike were awesome.

[Razors Edge ★]

1 hour ago, dennis said:

This is a 1x18 with an 11x112t cassette.

Honestly, I miss my singlespeeds. Those bike were awesome.

With bottles now!  Woot!

Somehow, I think that chain would start binding up somewhere on the silver section of that cassette.

[Razors Edge ★]

3 hours ago, Longjohn said:

I’m really considering that titanium gravel bike.

What make and model?  I think a travel bike of the road/touring/gravel variety with S&S couplers and titanium frame would be a nice bike too have. Not ready for it now, but maybe once the world settles down.

[dinneR ★]

1 hour ago, Razors Edge said:

With bottles now!  Woot!

Somehow, I think that chain would start binding up somewhere on the silver section of that cassette.

[Longjohn ★]

I was thinking the Lynskey GR300 Titanium Gravel Bike but I’ll do a lot more research before I actually buy. They have a number of models and figuring out the differences is confusing.

[dinneR ★]

Ti Fargo is the bike I lust after. Realistically, it's a $5k bike.

[Longjohn ★]

What are the advantages/disadvantages of internal cable routing?

That Lynskey is $4,000, can save a bit with external routing.

[dinneR ★]

4 minutes ago, Longjohn said:

What are the advantages/disadvantages of internal cable routing?

That Lynskey is $4,000, can save a bit with external routing.

It's clean, your cables stay out of harm's way. It makes working on your bike more difficult.

That Fargo above uses external, but with full cable housing.

[Razors Edge ★]

3 minutes ago, Longjohn said:

What are the advantages/disadvantages of internal cable routing?

That Lynskey is $4,000, can save a bit with external routing.

For me, it's mostly cosmetic but also does put the cables out of harms way for the most part.  I imagine if the bike was going to be an "around the world" adventure bike, fixing a busted cable on the side of a dirt road in Nepal might be super annoying.  On my Tarmac road bike with Di2, it really cleans up the look and presumably offers some aero advantage, but that's not really a gravel requirement.  My Diverge routes some stuff internally, and I like it there as well, and maybe having it internal also means that shifting cables aren't interfered with by frame bags? Hydraulic brakes wouldn't be affected.  Would mechanical brakes potentially be affected?

[Razors Edge ★]

5 minutes ago, dennis said:

It's clean, your cables stay out of harm's way. It makes working on your bike more difficult.

That Fargo above uses external, but with full cable housing.

If the extra cost was small, I would get internal routing if an option. BUT obviously folks rode the same trails and same roads for decades with the normal external routing. LJ seems like a guy who can handle a bike however it is built   The times I have watched build videos on youtube, internal is far more PITA, but it being internal, maybe it is a "install and forget" for the most part - especially if Di2 and hydraulic brakes - neither of which have requirements to replace worn/"stretched" cables.

[Longjohn ★]

I haven’t revisited this thread since I got my Lynskey but I did talk about it in the Cafe. My GR300 ended up costing $5,200 because I upgraded to Stan’s wheels and added a titanium back rack. The 2X11 turned out to not have a low enough granny gear so I changed the cassette to an 11-40 which seems to do the trick.

[ChrisL]

2 hours ago, Longjohn said:

I haven’t revisited this thread since I got my Lynskey but I did talk about it in the Cafe. My GR300 ended up costing $5,200 because I upgraded to Stan’s wheels and added a titanium back rack. The 2X11 turned out to not have a low enough granny gear so I changed the cassette to an 11-40 which seems to do the trick.

Is a 40 tooth cog stock or was it one of those conversion kits? 

[Longjohn ★]

I bought it from The Pro’s Closet, it’s a Shimano and I paid like $85 for it.