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Razors Edge

PZ - What Was The Verdict On Hawaii?

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29 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Bumped to the front of the retirement list? Scouted some good properties to consider? Found any new great spots? General impressions this time around?

The state, or the island? 

This trip was less about retirement research, as I got a conference rate for my hotel for the entire stay, so it was ocean-front luxury hotel living instead of any attempts at a long-term financial feasibility study. I did find the Wiamea area actually more expensive than Maui or Kauai, rivaled only by Honolulu in cost. If I had been in Kona (or Hilo), prices would have been more “reasonable”. 

I still don’t know if it’s going to be a 3-4 week per winter “snowbird” plan, or an actual year-round move. That will depend, in part, where my kids live after college. My youngest is just finishing freshman year of High School, so there is time to figure this out. Also, my current job has sweet perks for my kids’ college costs, so if the younger stays local for school, I’ll be tied here for a few years beyond that. 

The other part is whether I want to work there after I move, or just use it as a vacation/retirement getaway. That would also be influenced by how affordable health care will be, as I am just a little further away from being Medicare eligible than you are. So that would influence which island I moved to, if I did plan to achieve employment in my professional field. 

So... Maui in November, Kauai in February are my current investigational plans for 2019/2020.

Working there would more likely mean Oahu, while just living or snowbirding my current preference would be Kauai. 

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2 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

The state, or the island? 

This trip was less about retirement research, as I got a conference rate for my hotel for the entire stay, so it was ocean-front luxury hotel living instead of any attempts at a long-term financial feasibility study. I did find the Wiamea area actually more expensive than Maui or Kauai, rivaled only by Honolulu in cost. If I had been in Kona (or Hilo), prices would have been more “reasonable”. 

I still don’t know if it’s going to be a 3-4 week per winter “snowbird” plan, or an actual year-round move. That will depend, in part, where my kids live after college. My youngest is just finishing freshman year of High School, so there is time to figure this out. Also, my current job has sweet perks for my kids’ college costs, so if the younger stays local for school, I’ll be tied here for a few years beyond that. 

The other part is whether I want to work there after I move, or just use it as a vacation getaway. That would also be influenced by how affordable health care will be, as I am just a little further away from being Medicare eligible than you are. So that would influence which island I moved to, if I did plan to achieve employment in my professional field. 

So... Maui in November, Kauai in February are my current investigational plans for 2019/2020.

Working there would more likely mean Oahu, while just living or snowbirding my current preference would be Kauai. 

I love you and I hate you at the same time.  Hope you understand.

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1 minute ago, jsharr said:

I love you and I hate you at the same time.  Hope you understand.

Sure.

I find it both exhilarating and stressful to contemplate all of the issues. Part of me wonders if after a month, I’d prefer to not live on an island year-round. I think that is a real possibility. But I also think it’s pretty fantastic to consider. 

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Just now, Prophet Zacharia said:

Sure.

I find it both exhilarating and stressful to contemplate all of the issues. Part of me wonders if after a month, I’d prefer to not live on an island year-round. I think that is a real possibility. But I also think it’s pretty fantastic to consider. 

Great sailing!  

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1 minute ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

How do I say this nicely... fuck you? Is that it?

You missed my edit. It was an unfortunate omission.

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1 minute ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

How do I say this nicely... fuck you? Is that it?

You're talking about Hawaii, retirement, relaxing on the beach, yada yada yada.  How do you expect folks to react??? With kindness or joy?

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5 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

You're talking about Hawaii, retirement, relaxing on the beach, yada yada yada.  How do you expect folks to react??? With kindness or joy?

You asked, I answered. Somehow you avoided the need to call me a moron despite your stated opinion that there are other places to visit.

 

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1 minute ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

You asked, I answered. Somehow you avoided the need to call me a moron despite your stated opinion that there are other places to visit.

Me???? I'm very pro-Hawaii!  I am very enthusiastic about hearing your opinions on it as 1) a vacation spot, 2) a short-term residence, and 3) a permanent home.

You are absolutely NOT a moron (or a moran), so I think you meant this for rabble-rousing @Dottles.  He  may be moran or jsharr might consider him a dolt, but I think Kzoo still holds him in high regard.

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This sounds like a very pleasant retirement plan.  We're needing to stick here.  The cost is a little out of reach for us. 

I've only been to Kauai.  It was really nice.  We would like to see other islands there.  Just so many places to see on this amazing planet.

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Just now, Prophet Zacharia said:

No, I meant it for you in your defense of @Dottles‘s comment. 

There is back story to that.  While you were gone in paradise, there has been a LOT of complaining about the weather (snow, ice, yada yada), so I have been promoting the beauty and wonder of Hawaii.  Needless to say, folks are bristling at their choices in life, and that's where the snark from Dottles came from.

So, my apologies for riling them up in your absence.  I have even got pushback on my cheery avatar, so we know folks have Winter-fatigue.

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One man's paradise is another one's hell.  Opinions and all.

It seems like a paradise for the most part.  I think the biggest concerns that would arise are VOG, tourism woes, and island fever. Island fever would affect me, I think.  Maybe not for the first year, but after.

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2 minutes ago, Dirtyhip said:

One man's paradise is another one's hell.  Opinions and all.

It seems like a paradise for the most part.  I think the biggest concerns that would arise are VOG, tourism woes, and island fever. Island fever would affect me, I think.  Maybe not for the first year, but after.

Yep.  That's why I asked for the update from PZ.  He's a rational guy who seems to parallel my feelings on Hawaii, and I was interested in hearing if that had changed with this latest trip.  Island fever might be an issue for anyone, but I do find that I do know a lot of folks whose lives are mostly lived within island distances of their homes.  I generally only drive farther than 200 miles about five times a year, and tend to fly to places for vacations. So, I might not be as impacted by living on an island as I think. Cost of living is the big issue, as we have noted in other threads.

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23 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

There is back story to that.

Not an excuse. @Dottles need not be an asshole here. The difference in my COL over my adult life compared to had I lived in Seattle will more than offset my retirement expenditures, but I don’t call him a moron for living there. People have their reasons for living where they do, cost is a consideration but you’re not a moron for choosing a high priced place to live (or vacation). 

As DH says, there are lots of great places to visit in the world. but if there is actual consideration of moving somewhere, there is a lot of benefit to staying within the US. I’ve lived in Florida, I’ve visited California and the USVI.... Hawaii is better for me, in my opinion, IF I can make it work out on numerous issues. Finances being one.

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2 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

Not an excuse. @Dottles need not be an asshole here

Not an excuse.  I have him primed and ready to fire at reading the word "Hawaii", and you just happened to get in the middle.  My bad! Sorry.

Regarding COL, though, I think folks muddle that picture quite a bit, and maybe get too in the weeds as well.  Hawaiians have a totally different lifestyle than Pittsburghers or Seattlelites, so I think you either adapt to the Hawaiian way of living - which somehow over a million folks are able to afford - or you don't.  I see the bigger deal breaker being the constant in all early retirement planning - health care costs.  Add in "fit" for the environment (Dennis is more a mountains/snow guy, DH a more wooded MTB lady, jsharr a more ???), so Hawaii isn't for everyone.

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4 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Not an excuse.  I have him primed and ready to fire at reading the word "Hawaii", and you just happened to get in the middle.  My bad! Sorry.

Regarding COL, though, I think folks muddle that picture quite a bit, and maybe get too in the weeds as well.  Hawaiians have a totally different lifestyle than Pittsburghers or Seattlelites, so I think you either adapt to the Hawaiian way of living - which somehow over a million folks are able to afford - or you don't.  I see the bigger deal breaker being the constant in all early retirement planning - health care costs.  Add in "fit" for the environment (Dennis is more a mountains/snow guy, DH a more wooded MTB lady, jsharr a more ???), so Hawaii isn't for everyone.

So much this.  I am at peace with big trees, ferns, and moss.  The trails in Oregon are really great.  It is a destination town.

Where I live now is bumming me out with the dry cold weather.  Our landscape is not as beautiful as Oakridge.  I really hope we can get there at some point.  Hopefully not too old to enjoy it, either.  

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2 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Regarding COL, though, I think folks muddle that picture quite a bit

Agreed. Particularly if it’s living, and not just vacation. My experiment is to find if my projected retirement savings will allow me to live in a manner that is enjoyable. There will be no multimillion dollar homes on the cliffs, but also no shack just to be in Hawaii. But there is plenty in the middle.

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9 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

Agreed. Particularly if it’s living, and not just vacation. My experiment is to find if my projected retirement savings will allow me to live in a manner that is enjoyable. There will be no multimillion dollar homes on the cliffs, but also no shack just to be in Hawaii. But there is plenty in the middle.

Can you buy a home for under 200k. That is about our budget.

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7 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

There will be no multimillion dollar homes on the cliffs, but also no shack just to be in Hawaii. But there is plenty in the middle.

I watch some show call Buying Hawaii - like a House Hunters or House Hunters International - and you really see a broad range of prices and a wide mixture of pros & cons.  Definitely fun to watch, and while not truly "factual", it does give some insight into the market there. For example Kauai is ALL Princeville ALL the time.  Pretty interesting. $400k for a 2BR condo isn't crazy to me.  The prices are all over, though, so it does require boots on the ground to really know what things look like.

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5 minutes ago, Dirtyhip said:

Can you buy a home for under 200k. That is about our budget.

I don’t know.  I’m still in the “can I grocery shop” at an affordable price to live there longer-term. If I can do that, then I can consider what selling my house would allow for in comparison.

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2 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

I don’t know.  I’m still in the “can I grocery shop” at an affordable price to live there longer-term.

Walmart and Costco!

Some of the places on that show have an assortment of gardens for growing fruits or veggies.

And, you probably realized that the chickens are FREE!

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1 minute ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

I don’t know.  I’m still in the “can I grocery shop” at an affordable price to live there longer-term.

Lol. Good point. Its getting harder for that even here. Part of our issue is that we are going early so we have to plan well and have to keep costs down.  If I worked til 65, maybe...

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1 minute ago, Dirtyhip said:

Lol. Good point. Its getting harder for that even here. Part of our issue is that we are going early so we have to plan well and have to keep costs down.  If I worked til 65, maybe...

Yup, which gives me consideration to continue to work after moving there... and for the health insurance. But do I really want to work in my retirement destination? Maybe, if it gets me there earlier?

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8 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

Yup, which gives me consideration to continue to work after moving there... and for the health insurance. But do I really want to work in my retirement destination? Maybe, if it gets me there earlier?

We plan to continue working but possibly just 4 months a year. This will help. That and keeping debt at 0.

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1 hour ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

Not an excuse. @Dottles need not be an asshole here. The difference in my COL over my adult life compared to had I lived in Seattle will more than offset my retirement expenditures, but I don’t call him a moron for living there. People have their reasons for living where they do, cost is a consideration but you’re not a moron for choosing a high priced place to live (or vacation). 

As DH says, there are lots of great places to visit in the world. but if there is actual consideration of moving somewhere, there is a lot of benefit to staying within the US. I’ve lived in Florida, I’ve visited California and the USVI.... Hawaii is better for me, in my opinion, IF I can make it work out on numerous issues. Finances being one.

 

53 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Not an excuse.  I have him primed and ready to fire at reading the word "Hawaii", and you just happened to get in the middle.  My bad! Sorry.

Regarding COL, though, I think folks muddle that picture quite a bit, and maybe get too in the weeds as well.  Hawaiians have a totally different lifestyle than Pittsburghers or Seattlelites, so I think you either adapt to the Hawaiian way of living - which somehow over a million folks are able to afford - or you don't.  I see the bigger deal breaker being the constant in all early retirement planning - health care costs.  Add in "fit" for the environment (Dennis is more a mountains/snow guy, DH a more wooded MTB lady, jsharr a more ???), so Hawaii isn't for everyone.

I beg to differ. It's totally an excuse because RE gives me ribbings all the time -- context you may have missed @Prophet Zacharia. Both of you a good people and I probably agree with you on the Hawaii thing. Please, everybody relax. It was a good natured ribbing.  Honestly, I think he may have even enjoyed it. 🙂

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3 minutes ago, Dottles said:

 

I beg to differ. It's totally an excuse because RE gives me ribbings all the time -- context you may have missed @Prophet Zacharia. Both of you a good people and I probably agree with you on the Hawaii thing. Please, everybody relax. It was a good natured ribbing.  Honestly, I think he may have even enjoyed it. 🙂

You hit a nerve, I think.  

Honestly, people took my sassy comment about the men on this site being fail and old, better than your comment about HI residents are stupid.  Possibly, I am just cuter and have better delivery.  :nyanya:

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2 minutes ago, Dirtyhip said:

You hit a nerve, I think.  

Honestly, people took my sassy comment about the men on this site being fail and old, better than your comment about HI residents are stupid.  Possibly, I am just cuter and have better delivery.  :nyanya:

Heh.  PZ is good with me.  So is RE.  And we've met so certainly nothing directed your way Ms. Kill-them-on-the-trails-and-take-no-prisoners.  

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So far I have been to Maui (twice) and Kauai once.  I've been meaning to check out the big island.  I really have no desire to go to Oahu -- except maybe to go see Pearl Harbor.  Crowds and expenses don't excite me. But IMHO, I think Kauai is totally suitable to live -- and probably the big isle too.  

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I've been to Maui twice.  I liked it, but honestly, could imagine getting bored of paradise.  The weather is always perfect, the flowers always in bloom.  I've lived in New England my whole life and have always had seasons, I think I would miss them.

I know it sounds crazy to complain about paradise.  I was there with my wife about 6 years ago, I tried to imagine living there, and couldn't.

Then there is the tiny little issue of not being able to afford anything for sale on the whole island.

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2 hours ago, Dottles said:

So far I have been to Maui (twice) and Kauai once.  I've been meaning to check out the big island.  I really have no desire to go to Oahu -- except maybe to go see Pearl Harbor.  Crowds and expenses don't excite me. But IMHO, I think Kauai is totally suitable to live -- and probably the big isle too.  

Pearl Harbor is amazing. But the Arizona memorial is closed through the summer for maintance. Waikiki beach is very nice, but you’re right, very expensive. Outside of Honolulu is much less crowded. The North Shore is pretty rustic. Similarly, outside of Lahaina, Maui is less zany. The Big Island is a totally different beast. I feel really fortunate to have seen surface lava flowing in 2016, and the caldera full. Volcano National Park looks totally different now, but a place I always wish I had more time to spend in.

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4 hours ago, Razors Edge said:

Check out my link and scroll around the islands.

We stayed in a condo at Princeville. Ritzy place. Cocks and hens everywhere. 

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5 hours ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

Not an excuse. @Dottles need not be an asshole here. The difference in my COL over my adult life compared to had I lived in Seattle will more than offset my retirement expenditures, but I don’t call him a moron for living there.

Yeah, I have lived here my whole life and I feel comfortable if you called me a moron or moran. I'm ready for a change. I live here for my father and I live here for the tech. But it's clear Seattle isn't the same place it was even 15 years ago. I too am looking to get out but that won't happen until my father passes with support, love, and dignity. 50 years is a long time to be living in one general area.... especially when the COL is not in my favor. I am taking a strong look outside this state.

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Why not stay on your own lake. You could get property at Putin Bay on Lake Erie. Never have to worry about Volcanoes.  And a certain Russian politician might be spotted. I went there once but didn’t see him. 

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5 minutes ago, BuffJim said:

Why not stay on your own lake. You could get property at Putin Bay on Lake Erie. Never have to worry about Volcanoes.  And a certain Russian politician might be spotted. I went there once but didn’t see him. 

Three words. “Winter”, “snow” and “cold”.  Make that four. “Ohio”.

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