jsharr ★ Posted April 18, 2019 Share #1 Posted April 18, 2019 Are somethings meant to happen? I believe I was brought into this world on a predetermined date, and that I will leave this world on a predetermined date, over which I have little or no control. Between those two points, I think that each person has the ability to rise up, or sink down to whatever level they want, within reason. I do not see someone born into an isolated tribe on an island or in a rain forest with little or no contact with the outside world rising up to rule a great nation, but I could see that person rising up to oversee their tribe or a collection of tribes. What are your thougths on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Further Posted April 18, 2019 Share #2 Posted April 18, 2019 The cream always rises, but it can only rise to the top of the container it is in. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted April 18, 2019 Share #3 Posted April 18, 2019 24 minutes ago, jsharr said: I believe I was brought into this world on a predetermined date, and that I will leave this world on a predetermined date, over which I have little or no control. I believe that this is called predestination. And no since I have a free will and I live around other with free will I do not believe in fate or predestination. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted April 18, 2019 Share #4 Posted April 18, 2019 34 minutes ago, jsharr said: What are your thougths on this? You are a moran? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted April 18, 2019 Share #5 Posted April 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Razors Edge said: You are a moran? Whoa, them's fight'n words. Hey @jsharr, the n00b called you a moran. What do ya think about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randomguy Posted April 18, 2019 Share #6 Posted April 18, 2019 I think that is a load of horse crap, you think the gods give a whit about what happens, to people? Certainly not about the animals or to nature or whatnot, but humans, that is a big deal? “Yes Gladys, my PRI was really acting up at the bridge club, I don’t think they want me back”. Yeah the gods are keeping tabs on who said what and when, c’mon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted April 18, 2019 Share #7 Posted April 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Kzoo said: What do ya think about that? Do dolts think? Or have his thoughts been predetermined for him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12string Posted April 18, 2019 Share #8 Posted April 18, 2019 1. Yeah, the moran thing. 2. Trying to not take it to P&R, but - as inherently spiritual beings simply sidetracked into this temporary human mess, our true existence is not confined by time or space. So in our more permanent existence there is no birth or death date. Everything just kind of happens, not over time. So it isn't fate or predestiny, it just is. And, yes, as humans, we have the free will to muck it all up, so sure, we do change the course of events, but if they aren't truly defined by time or space, they just are, they aren't fate, and they are only destiny in so much that everything we're going to do already happened. 3. The islander example isn't destiny, it's opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted April 18, 2019 Share #9 Posted April 18, 2019 5 minutes ago, 12string said: 2. Trying to not take it to P&R, but - as inherently spiritual beings simply sidetracked into this temporary human mess, our true existence is not confined by time or space. So in our more permanent existence there is no birth or death date. Everything just kind of happens, not over time. So it isn't fate or predestiny, it just is. And, yes, as humans, we have the free will to muck it all up, so sure, we do change the course of events, but if they aren't truly defined by time or space, they just are, they aren't fate, and they are only destiny in so much that everything we're going to do already happened. But, an almighty creator would not just be able to but also seemingly HAVE to, as RG states, "give a whit about what happens to people" (and animals and every atom in the Universe). It then comes down to how intrusive that superbeing wants to be, and it seems they might just have the time (infinite), bandwidth (infinite) and energy (infinite) to be completely in control. Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12string Posted April 18, 2019 Share #10 Posted April 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Razors Edge said: But, an almighty creator would not just be able to but also seemingly HAVE to, as RG states, "give a whit about what happens to people" (and animals and every atom in the Universe). It then comes down to how intrusive that superbeing wants to be, and it seems they might just have the time (infinite), bandwidth (infinite) and energy (infinite) to be completely in control. Right? Just because It can, doesn't mean It wants to. Really, why would it? And why would It have to care? Probably be amused by is more like it. My particular understanding says that I am by nature in some way part of that creator, so it's me, too, laughing about what a clueless dolt I am. What I do here isn't the result of a Crerator being intrusive, but it more likely intrudes on that Creator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Grass Posted April 18, 2019 Share #11 Posted April 18, 2019 Do you believe in fate? I have in my life had a couple of significant improbable coincidences that I've been a part of which seem like fate. But then, it's really hard to imagine that a god would involve himself in my matters that, while very significant to me, don't mean shit for the other 107 billion people to have walked this world. So, no. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AirwickWithCheese Posted April 18, 2019 Share #12 Posted April 18, 2019 You are on the right track Jsharr. You'd have to give me more of your thoughts on predetermined. Predetermined is not the same as predestined which eliminates free will. I am busy building my squirrel shaped pool in the backyard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted April 18, 2019 Share #13 Posted April 18, 2019 Just now, AirwickWithCheese said: You are on the right track Jsharr. You'd have to give me more of your thoughts on predetermined. Predetermined is not the same as predestined which eliminates free will. I am busy building my squirrel shaped pool in the backyard. Are you a dolt? A predetermination is the action that creates predestination. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randomguy Posted April 18, 2019 Share #14 Posted April 18, 2019 Just now, Kzoo said: Are you a dolt? A predetermination is the action that creates predestination. I can't believe how many times I have been in agreement today. Something is in the water for sure. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12string Posted April 18, 2019 Share #15 Posted April 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, AirwickWithCheese said: Predetermined is not the same as predestined which eliminates free will. very good point 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted April 18, 2019 Author Share #16 Posted April 18, 2019 I was just tryiing to make a thought provoking or evoking or something thread for 12 string. I am not sure what I believe anymore. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randomguy Posted April 18, 2019 Share #17 Posted April 18, 2019 1 minute ago, jsharr said: I was just tryiing to make a thought provoking or evoking or something thread for 12 string. I am not sure what I believe anymore. Hey hey... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted April 18, 2019 Share #18 Posted April 18, 2019 Just now, Randomguy said: I can't believe how many times I have been in agreement today. Something is in the water for sure. I always get scared when I agree with Kazoo too much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted April 18, 2019 Share #19 Posted April 18, 2019 I don't think it matters whether or not I believe. Fate will be what it will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
late Posted April 18, 2019 Share #20 Posted April 18, 2019 There is nobody behind the curtain. Fate exists in the form of chance, and nothing more. We got past that in the Enlightenment, which was a long time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted April 18, 2019 Share #21 Posted April 18, 2019 I have no interest in rising to anything except maybe the pop tent in my pants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted April 19, 2019 Share #22 Posted April 19, 2019 4 hours ago, Randomguy said: I think that is a load of horse crap, you think the gods give a whit about what happens, to people? Certainly not about the animals or to nature or whatnot, but humans, that is a big deal? “Yes Gladys, my PRI was really acting up at the bridge club, I don’t think they want me back”. Yeah the gods are keeping tabs on who said what and when, c’mon. People have a really hard time with believing this is all there is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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