Best Bowl(s) So Far?

[Razors Edge ★]

With just one bowl game left, anyone want to rank their favorite from this year's group? @Dottie and the football-fevered @jsharr surely have some opinions.

Fiesta and Rose???

[Razors Edge ★]

These others are left:

Jan 2

TicketSmarter Birmingham Bowl
Boston College vs. Cincinnati

TaxSlayer Gator Bowl
Indiana vs. Tennessee

Jan. 3

Famous Idaho Potato Bowl
Ohio vs. Nevada

Jan. 4

Lockheed Martin Armed Forces Bowl
Southern Mississippi vs. Tulane

Jan. 6

LendingTree Bowl
Louisiana vs. Miami (Ohio)

[jsharr ★]

23 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

These others are left:

Jan 2

TicketSmarter Birmingham Bowl
Boston College vs. Cincinnati

TaxSlayer Gator Bowl
Indiana vs. Tennessee

Jan. 3

Famous Idaho Potato Bowl
Ohio vs. Nevada

Jan. 4

Lockheed Martin Armed Forces Bowl
Southern Mississippi vs. Tulane

Jan. 6

LendingTree Bowl
Louisiana vs. Miami (Ohio)

This

[jsharr ★]

Whatever random bowl the Texas Aggies won was the best.

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If you're a Clemson fan, you can't be too proud of that Fiesta bowl win.

[Razors Edge ★]

4 minutes ago, Rick5234 said:

If you're a Clemson fan, you can't be too proud of that Fiesta bowl win.

Too close? Poor officiating? Something else?

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Poor officiating.  It was an officiating crew from the SEC.  I think they had it in for the team from up north. 

pic.twitter.com/xWkUr7H6Vc

[jsharr ★]

2 minutes ago, Rick5234 said:

Poor officiating.  It was an officiating crew from the SEC.  I think they had it in for the team from up north. 

pic.twitter.com/xWkUr7H6Vc

Show it in real time.  I did not think it was a catch at the time when I watched in real time.   I can see it going either way.

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10 minutes ago, jsharr said:

Show it in real time.  I did not think it was a catch at the time when I watched in real time.   I can see it going either way.

You don't have to see it in real time, count the steps.  He already caught the ball.  It was originally ruled a completed pass and fumble by the refs who saw it in real time.

[jsharr ★]

18 minutes ago, Rick5234 said:

You don't have to see it in real time, count the steps.  He already caught the ball.  It was originally ruled a completed pass and fumble by the refs who saw it in real time.

Steps do not necessarily constitute a "football move". Looks to me, in real time, like the ball got there, the defender got there, he was stumbling around and the ball came loose before he did a football move. 

 

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55 minutes ago, jsharr said:

Steps do not necessarily constitute a "football move". Looks to me, in real time, like the ball got there, the defender got there, he was stumbling around and the ball came loose before he did a football move. 

This is from another forum not me. 

>> The NCAA case book covers this catch no catch scenario with example videos to guide officials. The sample most closely matching this play shows a receiver making a hand catch, taking 2 steps while falling, then losing the ball. The guidance was that the 2 steps are enough to constitute an "act common to the game" and officials should rule it a catch. The Clemson receiver took 3 full steps with firm possession. It's a catch per the NCAA case book. Not only should the play have stood, but if the field judge had called it incomplete, replay should have overturned it to a catch and immediate recovery by OSU. The only experts saying this was not a catch are all from the SEC. <<

[Dottleshead ★]

I didn't watch any of the bowl games this year.  I caught a glimpse of the Rose Bowl yesterday and that was about it.  

[jsharr ★]

4 minutes ago, Rick5234 said:

This is from another forum not me. 

>> The NCAA case book covers this catch no catch scenario with example videos to guide officials. The sample most closely matching this play shows a receiver making a hand catch, taking 2 steps while falling, then losing the ball. The guidance was that the 2 steps are enough to constitute an "act common to the game" and officials should rule it a catch. The Clemson receiver took 3 full steps with firm possession. It's a catch per the NCAA case book. Not only should the play have stood, but if the field judge had called it incomplete, replay should have overturned it to a catch and immediate recovery by OSU. The only experts saying this was not a catch are all from the SEC. <<

I see nothing saying two steps is a catch.  In full speed, during the game as I was watching, I did not feel it was a catch.  I am an A&M fan, but I will admit I do not like Ohio State, so that could be influencing my view point, just as being and OSU fan would influence it the other way.

 

ARTICLE 3. Catch, Interception, Recovery

 

1. To catch a ball means that a player:
   1. Secures control of a live ball in flight with his hands or arms before the ball touches the ground, and
   2. Touches the ground in bounds with any part of his body, and then
   3. Maintains control of the ball long enough to enable him to perform an act common to the game, i.e. long enough to pitch or hand the ball, advance it, avoid or ward off an opponent, etc., and
   4. Satisfies paragraphs b, c and d below.
2. If a player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass (with or without contact by an opponent), he must maintain complete and continuous control of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground, whether in the field of play or in the end zone. This is also required for a player attempting to make a catch at the sideline and going to the ground out of bounds. If he loses control of the ball which then touches the ground before he regains control, it is not a catch. If he regains control inbounds prior to the ball touching the ground, it is a catch.
3. If the player loses control of the ball while simultaneously touching the ground with any part of his body, or if there is doubt that the acts were simultaneous, it is not a catch. If a player has control of the ball, a slight movement of the ball, even if it touches the ground, will not be considered loss of possession; he must lose control of the ball in order for there to be a loss of possession.
4. If the ball touches the ground after the player secures control and continues to maintain control, and the elements above are satisfied, it is a catch.
5. An interception is a catch of an opponent’s pass or fumble.
6. A catch by any kneeling or prone inbounds player is a completion or interception (Rules 7-3-6 and 7-3-7).
7. A player recovers a ball if he fulfils the criteria in paragraphs a, b, c, and d for catching a ball that is still alive after hitting the ground.
8. h. When in question, the catch, recovery or interception is not completed.

[Razors Edge ★]

The GOLDEN RULE of any sporting event is to NEVER let an official's possible mistake be what determines whether you win or lose.  If you play sports long enough (and aren't cheaters like the Patriots), the bad calls and friendly calls even out. 

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So, what in there would make anyone think the three steps with the ball firmly in his grasp was not "an act common to the game"?

I get it, you're not an Ohio State fan, but you have no case here jsharr.  And I know shit happens in these games, but that's what the replay review is supposed to be for.  This was clearly a case of a SEC official being biased.  He doesn't like teams from the north apparently.

From a SI article.

>The decision has sparked much debate online since the game, and former NFL referee Terry McAulay was among those who weighed in on social media.

"This is a great angle. There is absolutely no way replay should have reversed. 'Indisputable video evidence' is simply not there," he said.

Ohio State athletic director Gene Smith even referenced McAulay's tweet in a text message to Yahoo Sports' Pete Thamel.

"Terry McAulay is 100-percent correct!!! Unreal!!" He added: "Feel free to share how pissed I am," Thamel shared on Twitter<

[Razors Edge ★]

1 minute ago, Rick5234 said:

I get it, you're not an Ohio State fan, but you have no case here jsharr.  And I know shit happens in these games, but that's what the replay review is supposed to be for.  This was clearly a case of a SEC official being biased.  He doesn't like teams from the north apparently.

Call me insane, but "doesn't like teams from the north"????? Seriously?

And, to be clear as well, SEC folks HATE Clemson and the ACC.  Bitterly.

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2 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Call me insane, but "doesn't like teams from the north"????? Seriously?

And, to be clear as well, SEC folks HATE Clemson and the ACC.  Bitterly.

Yeah, the 'good ole boy' network kicking in.

[Razors Edge ★]

Just now, Rick5234 said:

Yeah, the 'good ole boy' network kicking in.

By any chance are you an OSU guy?  I know jsharr isn't and is semi-impartial, but I'm wondering where you're coming from.

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Yeah, but I probably hate Clemson more than I like OSU.  But that was a terrible call either way you're looking at it.

[Kzoo]

3 hours ago, jsharr said:

 I can see it going either way.

That's why they should have let the call on the field stand.  He had control, had traveled close to 5 yards across the field before it was striped and was in the process of putting a 3rd step down.  Whatever the call on the field was, it should have stood.  I very much dislike OSU but this call was blown by the officials.

[jsharr ★]

3 minutes ago, Kzoo said:

That's why they should have let the call on the field stand.  He had control, had traveled close to 5 yards across the field before it was striped and was in the process of putting a 3rd step down.  Whatever the call on the field was, it should have stood.  I very much dislike OSU but this call was blown by the officials.

I believe if they feel it can go either way, instead of blowing it dead, based on what they thought they saw, they are supposed to let the play happen and then let the review process make the correction, if needed.

Like I said, that one could go either way.  In slow motion, looks like a catch, in real time, looks like an incomplete pass.   What is and is not a catch seems very subjective.  Just because your feet are moving, does not make it a football move.

[Razors Edge ★]

15 minutes ago, Kzoo said:

That's why they should have let the call on the field stand.  He had control, had traveled close to 5 yards across the field before it was striped and was in the process of putting a 3rd step down.  Whatever the call on the field was, it should have stood.  I very much dislike OSU but this call was blown by the officials.

Yeah, I (and everyone) think a call should not be overturned without very strong evidence.  Seemingly, either the ref saw that evidence or either 1) he's biased in some way or 2) he just made a bad call. I don't see any reason to assume he is biased.

* but jsharr is correct to that they often let them play to avoid stopping action even though it probably should have been stopped.

I COULD NEVER BE A REF!

[Kzoo]

Just now, Razors Edge said:

 I don't see any reason to assume he is biased.

And neither would the official's family.  You could ask them but they're busy packing for their all inclusive vacation to a resort island in the Bahamas paid for by a Clemson booster

[Razors Edge ★]

14 minutes ago, Kzoo said:

And neither would the official's family.  You could ask them but they're busy packing for their all inclusive vacation to a resort island in the Bahamas paid for by a Clemson booster

So you're saying OSU boosters are cheap?  There are likely a lot more OSU alum than Clemson alum, so someone needs to talk to their boosters and have them get their shit together for next year.

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39 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

even though it probably should have been stopped.

Why should it have been stopped?  It was a completed pass.  Even the man in charge of college football officiating didn't think it should have been overturned.  He's probably got more experience at this than us.

Report: College football's officiating coordinator says Ohio State's fumble return TD shouldn't have been overturned

[Razors Edge ★]

5 minutes ago, Rick5234 said:

48 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

even though it probably should have been stopped.

Why should it have been stopped?  It was a completed pass.  Even the man in charge of college football officiating didn't think it should have been overturned.  He's probably got more experience at this than us.

Report: College football's officiating coordinator says Ohio State's fumble return TD shouldn't have been overturned

My full quote was " they often let them play to avoid stopping action even though it probably should have been stopped. "

I didn't see the play in real time, and had no real comment on it.

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8 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

My full quote was " they often let them play to avoid stopping action even though it probably should have been stopped. "

My mistake.  I thought you were referring to that play specifically.

[Razors Edge ★]

4 minutes ago, Rick5234 said:

My mistake.  I thought you were referring to that play specifically.

No worries.  Like I wrote, I didn't see the play happen and have no real opinion on it now that it is over and done with.  I'm old enough to have seen too many bad calls to care any more.

My only pushback to you in particular is that the ref was biased.  I'd say the call could surely be considered a bad one, but the bias is completely out of left field (unless there is reporting that proves some trend).