Car Talk - are you a used or new buyer? Or an omnivore?

[Ralphie ★]

I usually buy new because I keep cars forever and I like to know where they've been.  The one I bought used recently had some problems that caused me concern - first, they tout "Cerfified Used Car" like it means something, but the one I bought had basically bald taars, so I made them put new ones on.  But at 33,000 miles, the taars shoudl really hav been in better shape, so was there an alignment problem?  So if something as obvious and visible as taars were not up to snuff, what can you expect for the hidden stuff?  Second, a subsequent Carfax showed it had been in a crash, as did the piece of grass under the clearcoat paint inside the passenger door jamb. 

Granted, I may have just had a bad dealer, and that is most of my point, I hate car dealers.  I am thinking of a place like Carmax or CarSense for the next one, although the Mrs. will not be happy, she prefers new.  I tend that way too, but I am right on the tipping point, because of the depreciation hit for new and the FUD for used.

Whatcha' think?  Are you sold on one way vs the other?  One of the carpool guys got his Fusion at Car Sense and it seems like new to me, so that is a big selling point.

 

[AirwickWithCheese]

Mr. Farnsworth, 

I look for 1 owner car directly from original owner which is no longer an easy accomplishment. This is the best way to find a cabriolet. 

[Airehead]

Generally new. Mostly because for all of our time together Mr Aire was required to have a new car less than 3 years old and his employer paid for it as part of compensation 

[JerrySTL ★]

Almost always new cars that we keep for at least 100K miles. Since 1992 I've only bought 2 used cars and one of them was to help out my son-in-law who bought a car too small for his family. It barely fit 4 people so when my daughter became pregnant with their third child, there was a big problems. The other was when we came back from England and couldn't swing 2 car payments.

[Further]

I bought the Toyota Sienna as certified used. I didn't really look at it very closely as I trusted the certified moniker....Mechanically it seems fine, but cosmetically I don't think it should have passed as certified used, the dealer used that thick, tinted wax to fill a lot of scratches on the body, and the interior shows some rough use when you look close.    Over all I'm happy with it though.

I will probably stick with buying used, but I will certainly look closer next time.    

[Dottleshead ★]

I think everyone owes it to themselves to own a new car at least once in their life.  I've owned 3.  But now that I have, I'm pretty sure the next car I buy definitely will not be.  I can buy a used car in very good shape for about 1/3 of one off the dealer's lot. Even if I have to put in a couple thousand in repairs down the road, it'd still be cheaper than buying a new one. But If cost is not the issue, I'd buy new one every time.

[Ralphie ★]

First impressions - I gave up trying to navigate to a CRV on Car Sense and went to Car Max and it came right up and I saw a 2016 EX with 14k miles for $22k.  First round a resounding success for Car Max.  Says verified one owner and has a carfax equivalent right online.  Unfortunately neither is close.  All Moot though because I doubt I can convince Mrs. Mooseworth.

[Dottleshead ★]

1 minute ago, RalphWaldoMooseworth said:

First impressions - I gave up trying to navigate to a CRV on Car Sense and went to Car Max and it came right up and I saw a 2016 EX with 14k miles for $22k.  First round a resounding success for Car Max.  Says verified one owner and has a carfax equivalent right online.

I've heard good things about Car Max.

[Ralphie ★]

4 minutes ago, Dottles said:

I've heard good things about Car Max.

I get those two hopelessly confused.  One has TV ads on all the time - I think it is Carmax.  Maybe Car Sense is a regional one if CarMax is out there too?  I thought one was more local.

OK, Uncle Google says Car Sense is smaller and more local.  Car Max has a ton of locations east of the Mississippi.

[Dottleshead ★]

2 minutes ago, RalphWaldoMooseworth said:

I get those two hopelessly confused.  One has TV ads on all the time - I think it is Carmax.  Maybe Car Sense is a regional one if CarMax is out there too?  I thought one was more local.

CarMax is the national one I think but can find you a car within an X mile radius -- whatever you put in there.

[late]

I try to find a 3 year old off lease with 100K on it. You have to be careful about the condition, but that's not hard. I then keep them for 10-15 years.

I miss CLick n Klack, the Tappet Brothers.

[Ralphie ★]

3 minutes ago, Dottles said:

CarMax is the national one I think but can find you a car within an X mile radius -- whatever you put in there.

Hmm - zooming oot on Google Maps stopped at the Mississippi but Car Max california showed a few.

[Ralphie ★]

4 minutes ago, late said:

I try to find a 3 year old off lease with 100K on it. You have to be careful about the condition, but that's not hard. I then keep them for 10-15 years.

I miss CLick n Klack, the Tappet Brothers.

To me an automagic transmission is a big crap shoot over 100k.  It shirley would suck to buy a car at 100k and have the transmission check oot 20 or 30k miles later.  I guess you get a warranty to cover that possibility, maybe just one year or so?

[Kzoo]

Used.  I think I’m n the market to replace my Civic.  Looking at CRV EX-L.  Maybe 

[Zephyr]

I tend to buy new..., because I run them into the ground.  My previous vehicle (Toyota Highlander) was 14 years old and wound up with my daughter and finally was not worth fixing when it had 435,000km(270,000 miles)

Our current vehicle is six years and still like new

[Further]

The Element is getting close to the end    Last inspection I was in the shop while it was up on the lift, there is a lot of rust under there. I asked the mechanic, whom I do trust, if he thought I could get a couple more years out of it, his reply was maybe one   

[Allen ★]

My last few Acuras have been new and traded in at 100,000 miles. 
 

[Dottleshead ★]

37 minutes ago, Zephyr said:

I tend to buy new..., because I run them into the ground.  My previous vehicle (Toyota Highlander) was 14 years old and wound up with my daughter and finally was not worth fixing when it had 435,000km(270,000 miles)

Our current vehicle is six years and still like new

I have had my new car since 2015 and have about 90k on it. I expect another 200,000 miles but it's a low rider and we want higher clearance. I now realize after the mistake that to buy new again would be costly.

[AirwickWithCheese]

I am hoping to find a one owner 1929 Chrysler 75 roadster with low miles

[MickinMD ★]

I've generally felt the same way - I've always bought new cars since college and usually keep them 10 years or more.

In 2013, I wanted to buy a Honda Fit.  The 2010-13 models were all virtually identical and all had won Consumer Reports best-bang-for-the-buck award and were rightly rated among the most fun to drive.

So I hoped to by a 2010-12 Fit with around 30K miles.  But the prices were so close to new, that I ended up getting a new 2013 Honda Fit base-automatic for $18,000 K total (no trade-in).

I'm guessing I'll be getting my last car in my late 70's around 2028.  By that time, hopefully self-parking and driver assist and safety stuff will be standard and I'll probably want a new car again. I've already "paid myself back" for the $18K cash I paid for the 2013 car and am saving more to cover those extra features.  I have a 2019 Subaru Forester rental last Spring and was amazed at all the safety features, from warning me when I was going over a white line in the road to being able to warn me with a loud noise if my head fell toward a shoulder as if falling asleep.

[Zephyr]

42 minutes ago, Dottles said:

I have had my new car since 2015 and have about 90k on it. I expect another 200,000 miles but it's a low rider and we want higher clearance. I now realize after the mistake that to buy new again would be costly.

When we went new, with the kids going and gone, we did not need another full sized SUV, but like you still wanted the ground clearance and I always have dive gear or camping gear or gockey gear in it, so we needed more than a car.  We ended up with a Rav4, and love it.  Not too big, but still hauls lots of stuff

[Dottleshead ★]

13 minutes ago, Zephyr said:

When we went new, with the kids going and gone, we did not need another full sized SUV, but like you still wanted the ground clearance and I always have dive gear or camping gear or gockey gear in it, so we needed more than a car.  We ended up with a Rav4, and love it.  Not too big, but still hauls lots of stuff

I was thinking about something that could pull 5,000 lbs too. I didn't realize the ground clearance would be so important to us until it was gone.

[Ralphie ★]

59 minutes ago, AirwickWithCheese said:

I am hoping to find a one owner 1929 Chrysler 75 roadster with low miles

Martin Mull really fits you as an avatar.

 

[The_Karen_Cooper_Incident]

The last three cars have been new.  Two Toyotas and one Ford. 

I prefer to buy new but will probably buy a used car next year as a second car. 

Mudkipz 

 

[Wilbur ★]

Mrs Wilbur buys new.  I get her hand me downs.   

I did buy a Mustang recently because Road Runner refused to sell me his.   I blame AWWC for this. 

[Guest]

Generally 2-3 year old one- owner. A friend owns a local dealership and he stands behind what he sells even with no factory warranty.

[ChrisL]

3 hours ago, Dottles said:

I've heard good things about Car Max.

I have purchased 3 cars from car max.  The good thing about them is the no haggle pricing.  You don’t always get the best deal but you always get a fair deal.  I bought my Legacy from a dealer as CarMax didn’t have any with the options I wanted but I started there.

The last 20 years I drove a lot of miles for work so burned up cars quickly.  New cars made no sense so  I got reliable cars that were lease trade ins, 3 years old about 30K miles. I kept them 3 years or so then traded them in for another lease trade in. 

Now that my driving habits have changed I may consider new for the next one but buying a good condition used car worked well for me.

[ChrisL]

Another thing about CarMax, if you are considering trading in a car, CarMax offers a free appraisal.  My SIL’s dad sells cars and he recommended I do this as dealers will honor their appraisal.

When I bought my Legacy, I took my Tiguan to CarMax 1st.  I let the dealer make me an offer on the Tiguan which was $2K less than what CarMax appraised it at.  I broke out the CarMax report, told the guy you guys are trying to screw me and the negotiations went much better from that point forward. They honored the CarMax appraisal and took a grand off the price of the Legacy.

[Scrapr ★]

I may be on my last car. 2019 Volvo  (waves pinky finger) I thought my mileage might go down. It has...but still a bit high at about 20k/yr. All the to & fro between Bend & Portland. I traded in my '17 Volvo and took WoScraprs when she passed. My last Volvo SUV went 313k miles. So that might be 15 years? I have been looking at Tesla though. After the '17 Volvo wagon I decided I'm a SUV guy. It was a pita getting in/out of that thing. So would need to be a Tesla X. So $80k. Which seems a lot for a spare car. 

Sold WoScraprs Rav4 to Carmax. They did a fair price and the transaction was easy. I got a price from Carmax for the Volvo wagon then asked the dealer if he wanted it. He beat them by about $2k. So that was an easy deal. I think I would buy a car from them

[Ralphie ★]

10 minutes ago, ChrisL said:

told the guy you guys are trying to screw me

And he laughed and said thought "well, yeah!".

 

Thanks for the info on Car Max.

 

[team scooter]

We buy new, and keep them until they have over 160,000 miles more or less. Our son buys used and gives us grief for buying new. But our two cars are over eight years old and run great. My truck is 16 years old and like new. He seems to always have car payments and gets a different one every few years. Ours have been paid off longer than not. 

[Longjohn ★]

4 hours ago, RalphWaldoMooseworth said:

First impressions - I gave up trying to navigate to a CRV on Car Sense and went to Car Max and it came right up and I saw a 2016 EX with 14k miles for $22k.  First round a resounding success for Car Max.  Says verified one owner and has a carfax equivalent right online.  Unfortunately neither is close.  All Moot though because I doubt I can convince Mrs. Mooseworth.

Sounds like a road trip is in order. How far is “not close”?

 

I have bought new (5 new) and bought slightly used and very used. I went through a period of time when the kids were little where all the vehicles I bought were well over 100,000 when I bought them. Most worked out well for me. The nice thing about making a mistake on a very used car is you don’t lose much. I once traded a very used VW camper van with a rotted out underside for a very used VW Rabbit. I think I paid $100 plus the van for the rabbit. It only lasted about six months and the engine gave out 100+ miles from home. It was Christmas and cold. The car quit in front of a used car lot that was closed for the Holiday but I saw someone walking around inside. I knocked on the door to ask if I could use their phone.

The man inside left me use the phone and I called my in-laws to explain we probably wouldn’t make it for Christmas. The owner of the car lot overheard my conversation and offered to give me a car to drive over the holiday to visit family. I told him I didn’t have any money. He said he didn’t want money. Take the car and have a good holiday, you can bring it back after you get back home. Merry Christmas. I have had a very blessed life.

[Ralphie ★]

4 minutes ago, Longjohn said:

Sounds like a road trip is in order. How far is “not close”?

 

I have bought new (5 new) and bought slightly used and very used. I went through a period of time when the kids were little where all the vehicles I bought were well over 100,000 when I bought them. Most worked out well for me. The nice thing about making a mistake on a very used car is you don’t lose much. I once traded a very used VW camper van with a rotted out underside for a very used VW Rabbit. I think I paid $100 plus the van for the rabbit. It only lasted about six months and the engine gave out 100+ miles from home. It was Christmas and cold. The car quit in front of a used car lot that was closed for the Holiday but I saw someone walking around inside. I knocked on the door to ask if I could use their phone.

The man inside left me use the phone and I called my in-laws to explain we probably wouldn’t make it for Christmas. The owner of the car lot overheard my conversation and offered to give me a car to drive over the holiday to visit family. I told him I didn’t have any money. He said he didn’t want money. Take the car and have a good holiday, you can bring it back after you get back home. Merry Christmas. I have had a very blessed life.

My wife's parents let us take their car to western PA for Christmas a few years ago when the van's front brakes started dragging right as we were leaving.  It probably did it good to get some long distance miles on it.

That $10,000 off for 4 years and 14k miles is quite tempting.  Now how to spin this for Mrs. Mooseworth...  Immediate purchase might do the trick, but she feels that she should have new after waiting 20 years for a new vehicle.

[groupw]

I have only bought 1 car new. Usually get a low mileage, 1-owner if I can. Our budget usually doesn’t have new in the plans. We are working to take care of some financial mistakes so our credit will be much better when it is time for the next vehicle. If I can’t find what I want used, I will buy it new. Our oldest daughter is working for Carvana. She was very helpful in getting us Carfax info on cars we looked at and will likely helped with the car search best time. 

[Rattlecan ★]

6 hours ago, late said:

I miss CLick n Klack, the Tappet Brothers.

I can still get repeat episodes that I have not heard before, or if I have, it was so long ago I don't remember them so it's all good. Those guys were a hoot.

[Longjohn ★]

The best car I ever owned was my Element. I bought it off a used car lot and discovered it had been a repo. That didn’t hurt a thing. When I traded it in as my wife wished the Honda dealership said it has had four owners and the odometer was recently tampered with as per the carfax report. The odometer was absolutely not tampered with And I find it highly unlikely the car had four owners. I would never put much weight on carfax, they are a big scam.  I bought the car when it was two years old. That’s a lot of turnovers in two years on a great car. I drove it for the next 11 years. Tires and brakes are the only things I changed on it.

[Ralphie ★]

26 minutes ago, Rattlecan said:

I can still get repeat episodes that I have not heard before, or if I have, it was so long ago I don't remember them so it's all good. Those guys were a hoot.

Hell, they were almost Canadians.  I guess SW, smudge, petite, ZackNY, etc. are too. 

 

[Further]

My real distinction or demarcation line is shiny or dull.

I've bought 2 new cars, an 84 Dodge pickup, and an 89 Isuzu Trooper.  The Trooper had a lot of issues but I kept it going for 170,some miles, the Dodge was a good truck.

I've bought a lot of cars that the shine was off, some were mistakes, others were gold. As cars have gotten more complicated, and repairs more costly, and paint longer lasting, buying the dull ones has become riskier. But you're not risking a lot...

Cars have become much more of a commodity item and if the maintenance has been done, no wrecks, no floods it is pretty predictable how much life is left.    

[maddmaxx ★]

8 hours ago, Dottles said:

I've heard good things about Car Maxx.

Of course.

[Tizeye]

I typically look at and prefer new, and some cars - like my Mini - do I really want to own it after the 4yr/50k mile warranty expires. (Except for tire road hazard replacement, everything has been taken care of under warranty, including replacing broken engine mount which  have never been replaced on an car I have owned. Additionally, $0 scheduled maintenance as Mini and parent BMW include 3yr/36K maintenance on MSRP, stated on the Moroney sticker for all models.) That concept developed when I worked at Lexus, and combined with past experience owning a used car. Remember the used car manager use to say "Never own an Audi A4 out of warranty" with it and other vehicles well know for engine sludge and other issues. Also, he was notorious for ultra low trade-in (killing our sale) and grossly inflated used with "certified" even higher. An example - Customer given $4000 for older (amazing condition) Lexus LS and listed on lot for $18,000. It was not unusual when we knew a customer was retuning for service after the sale before they completed the "Satisfaction survey" we had to quickly hide their trade-in on the back lot so they wouldn't see it.

Even before that experience, my experience with used didn't mathematically compute. If you typically trade around 100K miles, if you buy a used car around 40k (typical of ex-rentals that flood the used market and are within the 'certified' range) you would be trading at 60k miles actual usage.  With the wild west pricing on used but relatively know pricing on new, with aggressive negotiation while the price of used may be higher at the onset, adding in the extra usage of the 40k miles, new is actually cheaper. Also, ignoring the $500 junkers the kids learned on, last used was a Chrysler LeBaron Convertible. A hidden cost to second owners using the original warranty was a $50 deductible vs $0 for original owners. That always grinded on me when I needed a new water pump or something. While out of warranty, but probably a hidden warranty due to litigation, the car went through 3 transmissions. The first was mostly covered, lasted a week which was 100% covered. A year later, it was having issues and the car was traded in (holding my breath when they west drove it).

[maddmaxx ★]

When I was buying prospective race cars, and doing all of my own maintenance up to and including engine swaps I bought used.  After I got married in 73, except for one Vega prospective race body and one clapped out formula ford chassis I've bought new family cars.  That has worked well as I usually keep them till they are dead.  The two 80's turbo Shelby Daytonas were an exception as I wanted nothing to do with then after the warranty ran out.  The only other early trade in was the Scion IQ after 5 years because I wanted a larger car for family use.

[Longjohn ★]

2 hours ago, Tizeye said:

everything has been taken care of under warranty, including replacing broken engine mount which  have never been replaced on an car I have owned.

Did you always buy automatics or do you just drive like a girl? 

[Tizeye]

17 minutes ago, Longjohn said:

Did you always buy automatics or do you just drive like a girl? 

Even in my Triumph Spitfire (also bought used), engine mount was least of my concerns. Probably the biggest and impacting shifting was a clean break in the cast iron bell housing sleeve that the throwout bearing rode on. It was so clean that missed it the first time and had to pull - note "pull" not "drop" - the transmission twice.

[Allen ★]

7 minutes ago, Tizeye said:

Even in my Triumph Spitfire (also bought used), engine mount was least of my concerns. Probably the biggest and impacting shifting was a clean break in the cast iron bell housing sleeve that the throwout bearing rode on. It was so clean that missed it the first time and had to pull - note "pull" not "drop" - the transmission twice.

My brother had a spitfire. 

[maddmaxx ★]

18 minutes ago, Allen said:

My brother had a spitfire. 

Was she hot?

[Allen ★]

1 minute ago, maddmaxx said:

Was she hot?

He had one of those too.

[sheep_herder ★]

 

[late]

About 30 years ago, we bought an Accord with 100K on it. We put over 100K on it, and gave it to one of the kids of a good friend. The odometer died at some point, but if I had to guess, he put over 50K on it before it couldn't get a sticker. I think it got close to 300.

That taught me something. I look for off lease cars with high mileage, you can tell if they were highway miles, the car's in good shape.

My last car was 11K and it had a lot of life in it when it got totaled after 10 years. That's roughly the goal, a cost of about $1K/yr.

I also put down 3-5K, take a loan for the balance, and make payments 50-100% more than what they ask for. So we own it after a couple of years. Then we try to go a decade without a car loan.

[dinneR ★]

I've owned four cars. One new and three used. My current car is 17 years old. I drive it so little, I'm going squeak as much life out of it as I can. I've been driving about 3k/year so buying a new car doesn't make much sense. If I found decent Subaru at a fair price, I might pick it up. I like not having a car payment.

[Square Wheels]

Custom made, new.