What does white privilege mean to you?

[Wilbur ★]

2 hours ago, shootingstar said:

You mean if there was a Democrat white guy president that got elected?  Vs. Trump re-elected.  Anyway no point as a Canuck, trying to figure out the complex U.S. landscape,

Canada has its own problems..right now.  There are native Indian blockades across different areas of the  national rail lines.  It's literally stopped passenger rail and each day, more freight rail lines.  On the west coast, there's a backup of ships that can't unload for non-existent rail trains.

Based on US history, small things like Jim Crow Law, KKK and slavery were all introduced of the Democratic regimes.  Abolitionism, republican. 

[MoseySusan]

2 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

Based on US history, small things like Jim Crow Law, KKK and slavery were all introduced of the Democratic regimes.  Abolitionism, republican. 

First, Jim Crow, the KKK, and slavery were never small things. 
Second, a significant shift in the Democratic platform happened with swelling urban populations and the rise of labor unions. Leaning more toward civil rights and social safety nets, Democratic candidates attracted black voters over their more conservative, gradualist opponents. 

[maddmaxx ★]

4 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

Based on US history, small things like Jim Crow Law, KKK and slavery were all introduced of the Democratic regimes.  Abolitionism, republican. 

Based on US history, the two parties swapped positions on policy after those events.  Today the parties represent almost exactly the opposite of what they represented back then.  

https://www.livescience.com/34241-democratic-republican-parties-switch-platforms.html

While it's semantically correct to say that the Democrats did those things, they are opposed to such things today.  The comparison to modern politics thus doesn't hold much in the way of accuracy.

[Wilbur ★]

2 minutes ago, roadsue said:

First, Jim Crow, the KKK, and slavery were never small things. 
Second, a significant shift in the Democratic platform happened with swelling urban populations and the rise of labor unions. Leaning more toward civil rights and social safety nets, Democratic candidates attracted black voters over their more conservative, gradualist opponents. 

First- sarcasm

Second- Yes, the Democrats shifted and are now shifting to extremes.   This will end badly. 

[maddmaxx ★]

2 minutes ago, roadsue said:

First, Jim Crow, the KKK, and slavery were never small things. 
Second, a significant shift in the Democratic platform happened with swelling urban populations and the rise of labor unions. Leaning more toward civil rights and social safety nets, Democratic candidates attracted black voters over their more conservative, gradualist opponents. 

Actually it was a bit more cynical than that.  The expansion into the west post civil war left both parties scrambling for the western votes.  The shift in parties policies followed.

[Wilbur ★]

1 minute ago, maddmaxx said:

Actually it was a bit more cynical than that.  The expansion into the west post civil war left both parties scrambling for the western votes.  The shift in parties policies followed.

True, yet Republicans have no racist policies nor actions.  None.  Statistics are showing non-white Americans are prospering under the current administration. 

[MoseySusan]

Just now, maddmaxx said:

Actually it was a bit more cynical than that.  The expansion into the west post civil war left both parties scrambling for the western votes.  The shift in parties policies followed.

As with so much of history, it’s complex but threads of meaning gain momentum given time. Cynical, self-serving...Black politicians in urban districts wanted votes; constituencies wanted change. The New Deal worked for both. 

[maddmaxx ★]

1 minute ago, Wilbur said:

True, yet Republicans have no racist policies nor actions.  None.  Statistics are showing non-white Americans are prospering under the current administration. 

Statistics and politicians are notorious for lying when used in ways that favor their side.  Gerymandering is exclusively a racist policy.

[maddmaxx ★]

3 minutes ago, roadsue said:

As with so much of history, it’s complex but threads of meaning gain momentum given time. Cynical, self-serving...Black politicians in urban districts wanted votes; constituencies wanted change. The New Deal worked for both. 

This is why political history and politics in general is much more complicated than the binary party system we currently have would indicate.

Remember though that unlike individuals, political parties are not as interested in your well being as they are in acquiring and maintaining power.  They do what they do because they believe that they will get more votes that way.

[MoseySusan]

1 minute ago, Wilbur said:

True, yet Republicans have no racist policies nor actions.  None.  Statistics are showing non-white Americans are prospering under the current administration. 

There’s a difference between prosperity and nominal increases in job numbers. 
 

The wage gap disproportionately affects non-whites. And it’s meant to. 

[MoseySusan]

1 minute ago, maddmaxx said:

This is why political history and politics in general is much more complicated than the binary party system we currently have would indicate.

Right? And it’s disingenuous to nuance party affiliation with modifiers like “moderate” or “progressive,” and “fiscal conservative.” We have two recognized parties, and a lot of gray area.

[Wilbur ★]

7 minutes ago, roadsue said:

The wage gap disproportionately affects non-whites. And it’s meant to. 

How long has that gap been around?  

[Wilbur ★]

9 minutes ago, roadsue said:

There’s a difference between prosperity and nominal increases in job numbers. 

November will tell.  I suspect another shift is in the wind with the black population.   But, hell, there should be at least two more impeachments by then.   

[MickinMD ★]

There IS a degree of white privilege in terms of preferences in hiring and attitudes about intelligence and culture.

But, from the perspective of growing up as a white kid in a very poor family with a disabled father, note that the Kennedys have been lauded for what they've done for minorities but not ONE Kennedy or upper-middle class or higher white had to step aside to let low SAT minorities take their place in college or even take their scholarships. It was the poor white kids who bore that burden.

The last time I mentioned this subject I was ridiculed and stamped as someone who wanted to protect my privileges!  What privileges were those?  No vacations as a kid, listening to my childhood friends tell me of their fun at the ocean or Boy Scout Jamboree and imagining what it must be like?  Was it a privilege to spread the jam thin to make the jar last because who knew when mom would be able to afford another jar?  Was it a privilege to watching the neighborhood kids play in the snow while I kept my hands mostly in my pockets because I owned no gloves?  How was I a privileged kid?

I learned, early on in life, that if you REALLY wanted to succeed and you were a poor white kid, hard work will get you noticed and, while it may not make you rich, will provide you with a respected and better than average living. I have above avg. intelligence but am NOT a genius. Tell me where "privilege" and not hard work won me any of the following. 

I scored a 1530 out of 1600 on the SAT's. I was accepted to and worked my way through college, getting a job in high school so I could buy a car and commute to college: my parents had no car. At UMBC, I had the highest test average score in my sophomore Organic Chemistry class of 165 students and was doing extra research under the course's Professor - on top of working fast-food at night. Another professor got a grant and - DUH - picked and hired me to do research under him.  I coauthored published papers in journals like The Journal of the American Chemical Society and was chosen to give a talk on my research at the National Meeting of the American Chemical Society in Washington,  I achieved the UMBC Chemistry Dept. record scores on the GRE's (SAT's for grad school) in Chemistry and Math.  I won a full scholarship ($50K/yr in today's money) and a teaching assistantship ($1700/month in today's money) to grad school at IIT, one of the USA's top-20 chemistry grad schools.  A few years after graduating, I was named Chief Chemist of Process Development at Minerec, a subsidiary of Dow Chemical based on my success in making patented processes for the manufacture of several chemicals, including a biodegradable pesticide and a non-carcinogenic additive to kids clothes to make them flameproof.  Later, worried about the large number of industrial bench chemists dying of cancer, I switched to teaching and in my 3rd year was named Lead Gifted and Talented Teacher for Chemistry and Physics at Maryland's largest high school.  Even though there is a fixed no-difference in pay based on sex, race, etc., I earned an extra $10,000 in today's money/year because of the degrees I had and additional certifications (Advanced Teaching, Advanced Placement, etc.) I studied for in the summers.

 

[late]

1 hour ago, Zephyr said:

Is it possible to ask your thought process that lead to this conclusion without this turning into a political discussion?  Like @shootingstar I sometimes do not understand the US politcal landscape

You can see it here:

https://www.politicsforum.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=177936

[late]

3 hours ago, BuffJim said:

If Trump wins re-election, then for the most part, except for far left Democrats, racism in America will fade away.  If the Democrats re-gain the white house, lookout.

You have that completely bass ackwards.

This is the 3rd historic wave of racism. We started re-segregating in 1989. There's a lot in there if you look at it.

[late]

3 hours ago, shootingstar said:

What would make it worse, depending on election outcome? 

You can see part of it here:

https://www.politicsforum.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=177936

[Randomguy]

35 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

Republicans have no racist policies nor actions.  None.  

Wait...wut?  "There are good people on both sides"?  Racists and WS folks in the inner circle?  I'd say it is pretty clear that this administration has a lot of shit head influencers who are doing all the influencing they can.  They just get mixed in with all the other shit head influencers doing all the influencing they can to keep the rich and entrenched rich and entrenched.

[BuffJim]

1 minute ago, late said:

You have that completely bass ackwards.

This is the 3rd historic wave of racism. We started re-segregating in 1989. There's a lot in there if you look at it.

Not buying it.  Your side used to play the race card successfully. It doesn't work anymore. I see much less racism and hate on the right side of the spectrum.

[Randomguy]

3 minutes ago, BuffJim said:

I see much less racism and hate on the right side of the spectrum.

There is much to question in this statement.  On the surface, your argument is patently false.  You got a guy spewing hatred every day setting the tone for the party, it is ostensibly a party of hatred of anything that is not like them.

[BuffJim]

Just now, Randomguy said:

There is much to question in this statement.  On the surface, your argument is patently false.

But if you view it honestly, you will see it rings true, grasshopper.

Why are the two most hateful angry people in America named Joy and Whoopi?  Ever think of that?

Why did Late have to drag politics into this? It gets tiresome.

 

[Randomguy]

2 minutes ago, BuffJim said:

Why are the two most hateful angry people in America named Joy and Whoopi?  Ever think of that?

I don't know who Joy is, but I can't stand Whoopi.  No eyebrows freak me out.  They aren't in government, though, so that is a good thing.

[late]

12 minutes ago, BuffJim said:

Not buying it.  Your side used to play the race card successfully. It doesn't work anymore. I see much less racism and hate on the right side of the spectrum.

Those are facts, kiddo.

[Randomguy]

42 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

But, hell, there should be at least two more impeachments by then.

We can only hope that some on the scum side can grow spines and get rid of folks who feel they are above the law in a very public way.

I generally feel that I am above the law, but I try not to be so public, tactless, and hateful about it.

[BuffJim]

3 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

I don't know who Joy is, but I can't stand Whoopi.  No eyebrows freak me out.  They aren't in government, though, so that is a good thing.

Joy is a more bitter and hateful version of Whoopi, if that were possible.

[Randomguy]

22 minutes ago, BuffJim said:

I see much less racism and hate on the right side of the spectrum.

Thanks, Obama!  

[maddmaxx ★]

38 minutes ago, BuffJim said:

But if you view it honestly, you will see it rings true, grasshopper.

Why are the two most hateful angry people in America named Joy and Whoopi?  Ever think of that?

Why did Late have to drag politics into this? It gets tiresome.

 

You could not have expected a white privilege thread to not be political in this world.  I'm surprised that the mods didn't close it the day it opened.

[Kzoo]

22 minutes ago, maddmaxx said:

I'm surprised that the mods didn't close it the day it opened.

Because it had stayed respectful at that point.

I saw just a bit of a piece the other day that addressed some of this.  I wish I could explain it better but it dealt with the restrictions on language and other PC constructs, intended to legislate anti-racists actions, have an opposite effect.  A backlash effect.  The argument was being used to explain a rise in racism for the same reasons that there has been a rise in nationalism in our parts of the world.  Part of the argument is that forcing 'correctness' results in a backlash against the original group(s).  He was not taking sides or advocation action.  This was more a discussion of societal constructs.

As to white privilege -  3 white teens wearing hoodies heading in your direction on the sidewalk.  You smile and say Hi as you pass by. - Now 3 black teens wearing hoodies heading in your direction on the sidewalk.  Do you consider crossing the street to use the other sidewalk?

My best friend is a 40 yo black guy who grew up in South Central, joined the Marines and owns his own business.  He pulled himself up from a bad place to start (speaking of white privilege), served his county and has created a place of employment for others.  He gets pulled over at least twice a year for being black.  The last time I was pulled over was because I did something wrong 11 years ago.

[Randomguy]

3 minutes ago, Kzoo said:

Because it had stayed respectful at that point.

It is nice when that happens!

[Randomguy]

5 minutes ago, Kzoo said:

3 white teens wearing hoodies heading in your direction on the sidewalk.  You smile and say Hi as you pass by. - Now 3 black teens wearing hoodies heading in your direction on the sidewalk.  Do you consider crossing the street to use the other sidewalk?

Any teens you want to kill, because teens suck.  

 

5 minutes ago, Kzoo said:

He gets pulled over at least twice a year for being black.  The last time I was pulled over was because I did something wrong 11 years ago.

Every now and then when I had a car, I would get pulled over for seemingly no reason.  Bored cops, cops looking for someone to write up, and so forth.  Not twice a year though, your buddy should know better than to drive around being black and all.  Does he drive a red sports car or a humvee or somesuch?  Does he have "Kill whitey" bumper stickers?

Not getting pulled over for DWW is about the only privilege I see benefits from.  I have been discriminated against for being white a few times that I know of.

[Wilbur ★]

9 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

It is nice when that happens!

Just don't tell your other friends about it.   

[Zephyr]

I worked front line duties for 18 years and have pulled over literally thousands of vehicles in 'routine stops'.  Unless I knew the vehicle ahead of time, I never knew the race of the driver until I walked up to the drivers door.  We were always way more focused on how many people and where they were in the car than we were concerned about the drivers skin tone

[Wilbur ★]

3 minutes ago, Zephyr said:

I worked front line duties for 18 years and have pulled over literally thousands of vehicles in 'routine stops'.  Unless I knew the vehicle ahead of time, I never knew the race of the driver until I walked up to the drivers door.  We were always way more focused on how many people and where they were in the car than we were concerned about the drivers skin tone

They probably found the cast iron helmet intimidating.  

[Kzoo]

5 minutes ago, Zephyr said:

I worked front line duties for 18 years and have pulled over literally thousands of vehicles in 'routine stops'.  Unless I knew the vehicle ahead of time, I never knew the race of the driver until I walked up to the drivers door.  We were always way more focused on how many people and where they were in the car than we were concerned about the drivers skin tone

I think there might have been something to you being RCMP.  Here the local guy will be the first to do a DWB.  I would expect it less from the county and even less from the State Police.  The higher up the ladder the more professional.  Do they get any higher up the professional ladder than RCMP and English Bobbies

[Wilbur ★]

Just now, Kzoo said:

Do they get any higher up the professional ladder than RCMP

They get less professional the higher up the RCMP ladder..  

[Kzoo]

Just now, Wilbur said:

They get less professional the higher up the RCMP ladder..  

Don't burst the bubble.

 

[maddmaxx ★]

46 minutes ago, Kzoo said:

 

As to white privilege -  3 white teens wearing hoodies heading in your direction on the sidewalk.  You smile and say Hi as you pass by. - Now 3 black teens wearing hoodies heading in your direction on the sidewalk.  Do you consider crossing the street to use the other sidewalk?

Incorrect.  I worry about body language, not clothing or color.

 

And the concept that a political thread is ok in a forum with political ban is ludicrous.  If you intend to have politics restore P&R and then you mods can do you job there insuring that it stays respectful.  Otherwise it's just another playground for favoritism and who the mods will allow to say things and who they won't.