Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #1 Posted January 8, 2019 Road around the lake again today. 11.5 miles. I rode in the lowest level of assist possible but did kick it up to level 2 for a half mile stretch during a hilly, heavily commuted stretch. Anyway, want to share/confirm a few thoughts. Things I like: 1. Riding an e-bike w/o assist can be done but you're pedaling a tank. So I do from time to time but it sorta defeats the whole purpose of an electric bike. So I almost always have it in the first pedal assist mode (there are 4). 2. E-bikes are hill eaters. In fact, this is their greatest advantage in my view. You can work as hard as you want to but hills and routes not really an option now become viable alternatives 3. My wife loves it -- so if she rides more then we ride more. Win win. 4. I have 10 gears and I use most of them regularly. But now I have 4 options to use for each gear. So it's possible to just use 3 or 4 gears... which is what I find I do mainly. The advantage I suppose is that I don't have as much wear and tear on the drive train. For example, I am no longer caught be surprise of the terrain and shifting under stress never happens anymore. For example, I am riding a blind curve and as I make the turn (and slowed) I see an immediate steep grade hill that I need to down shift for while driving the chainring. All I do now is touch a button without changing gears and suddenly I have less resistance -- without losing speed. Things I dislike: 1. They're tanks 2. In colder environments, I need to remove the battery and bring it indoors when done with a ride. 3. Battery needs to be removed before throwing it up on a bus rack... any rack really. It weighs about 7-8 pounds. 4. It is possible to not ride as hard as before -- some might call it laziness -- a real thing. Even though you're getting roughly the same cardiovascular workout, clearly you're burning only 2 calories compared to about 3 on your regular road bike. 5. They're tanks 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted January 8, 2019 Share #2 Posted January 8, 2019 What’s this thread about? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #3 Posted January 8, 2019 1 minute ago, Kzoo said: What’s this thread about? Nominated. OMG. I don't know if you realize just how funny that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted January 8, 2019 Share #4 Posted January 8, 2019 Just now, Dottles said: Nominated. OMG. I don't know if you realize just how funny that is. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #5 Posted January 8, 2019 Just now, Kzoo said: Sorry. Are you Farmer Jones?? @Page Turner we need a ruling here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dinneR ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #6 Posted January 8, 2019 19 minutes ago, Dottles said: Road around the lake again today. 11.5 miles. I rode in the lowest level of assist possible but did kick it up to level 2 for a half mile stretch during a hilly, heavily commuted stretch. Anyway, want to share/confirm a few thoughts. Things I like: 1. Riding an e-bike w/o assist can be done but you're pedaling a tank. So I do from time to time but it sorta defeats the whole purpose of an electric bike. So I almost always have it in the first pedal assist mode (there are 4). 2. E-bikes are hill eaters. In fact, this is their greatest advantage in my view. You can work as hard as you want to but hills and routes not really an option now become viable alternatives 3. My wife loves it -- so if she rides more then we ride more. Win win. 4. I have 10 gears and I use most of them regularly. But now I have 4 options to use for each gear. So it's possible to just use 3 or 4 gears... which is what I find I do mainly. The advantage I suppose is that I don't have as much wear and tear on the drive train. For example, I am no longer caught be surprise of the terrain and shifting under stress never happens anymore. For example, I am riding a blind curve and as I make the turn (and slowed) I see an immediate steep grade hill that I need to down shift for while driving the chainring. All I do is touch a button and suddenly I have less resistance -- without losing speed. Things I dislike: 1. They're tanks 2. In colder environments, I need to remove the battery and bring it indoors when done with a ride. 3. Battery needs to be removed before throwing it up on a bus rack... any rack really. It weighs about 7-8 pounds. 4. It is possible to not ride as hard as before -- some might call it laziness -- a real thing. Even though you're getting roughly the same cardiovascular workout, clearly you're burning only 2 calories compared to about 3 on your regular road bike. 5. They're tanks The Orbea Gain is less of a tank at 28lbs. Most of my bikes weigh more than that and they are not e-bikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #7 Posted January 8, 2019 1 minute ago, dennis said: The Orbea Gain is less of a tank at 28lbs. Most of my bikes weigh more than that and they are not e-bikes. Yeah, I considered it. I decided it was more important to me to be able to easily throw crap on my bike and elected for more of the commuter type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dinneR ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #8 Posted January 8, 2019 9 minutes ago, Dottles said: Yeah, I considered it. I decided it was more important to me to be able to easily throw crap on my bike and elected for more of the commuter type. I think the other manufacturers will start reducing battery size and weight like the Orbea pretty soon. It's hard to peg it as an e-bike. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #9 Posted January 8, 2019 Yeah, it's a thing of beauty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petitepedal ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #10 Posted January 8, 2019 I already have a tank...why do I need an electric one 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #11 Posted January 8, 2019 You don't unless you live in an area with lots of hills... and fatigue and speed matter to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petitepedal ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #12 Posted January 8, 2019 LOL Dottie..more than once I have wished for a motor..an assist on the hills on my commute would be grand..especially at the end of the day when it is 90 degrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #13 Posted January 8, 2019 43 minutes ago, Kzoo said: What’s this thread about? Tanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #14 Posted January 8, 2019 1 minute ago, petitepedal said: LOL Dottie..more than once I have wished for a motor..an assist on the hills on my commute would be grand..especially at the end of the day when it is 90 degrees. 90 degrees in the northern latitudes is BRUTAL. I would think the South would be this way too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #15 Posted January 8, 2019 1 minute ago, jsharr said: Tanks You're welcome. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #16 Posted January 8, 2019 16 minutes ago, petitepedal said: I already have a tank...why do I need an electric one How do those front racks works for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #17 Posted January 8, 2019 I forgot an important thing. Acceleration from a dead stop on an e-bike is great. You can get through intersections quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #18 Posted January 8, 2019 7 hours ago, petitepedal said: I already have a tank...why do I need an electric one Maybe so it won’t take all day to climb a gentle slope? (Runs and hides) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #19 Posted January 8, 2019 Which color do you want @petitepedal? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donkpow Posted January 8, 2019 Share #20 Posted January 8, 2019 I enjoy reading the serious e-bike comments. I think I would rather have an e-bike that was primarily for riding with the electrics rather than assisting pedaling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #21 Posted January 8, 2019 3 minutes ago, donkpow said: I enjoy reading the serious e-bike comments. I think I would rather have an e-bike that was primarily for riding with the electrics rather than assisting pedaling. My wife’s Hilltopper conversion you can ride without pedaling except on the steep hills you have to help because the motor doesn’t have gears. My wife will ride with me and the granddaughters and when she has had enough (usually we are already heading back) she stops pedaling and uses the motor to return. It works out great because she would not be able to ride with us without it. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donkpow Posted January 8, 2019 Share #22 Posted January 8, 2019 24 minutes ago, Longjohn said: My wife’s Hilltopper conversion you can ride without pedaling except on the steep hills you have to help because the motor doesn’t have gears. My wife will ride with me and the granddaughters and when she has had enough (usually we are already heading back) she stops pedaling and uses the motor to return. It works out great because she would not be able to ride with us without it. That makes a lot of sense to me. Buy an electric bike to ride an electric bike. If you want to pedal, okay, pedal. I'd also like to see an electric bike that you could shift. I understand most people wouldn't be able to deal with it but I could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #23 Posted January 8, 2019 2 minutes ago, donkpow said: That makes a lot of sense to me. Buy an electric bike to ride an electric bike. If you want to pedal, okay, pedal. I'd also like to see an electric bike that you could shift. I understand most people wouldn't be able to deal with it but I could. I think all the new ones drive your crank so shifting your gears for the pedals shifts them for the motor as well. My wife’s motor is in the wheel hub and just direct drives the wheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #24 Posted January 8, 2019 @donkpow I won't be able to pay off these bikes until April -- but I'm glad I bought them, I've already gone on 4 rides during the holidays that I would not have normally been able to do. They are perfect for this terrain around here and coming shortly I'll be riding to and from the transit center. I do have rain gear but honestly the month of January really sucks so I may not get out there until February to do the commute thing, But it's pretty sweet knowing I got an hour's worth of riding in on a route I would have never done with a conventional bike -- in half the time. There other thing I'll be paying attention to is how well it keeps me primed for the real thing. If I am riding more during the winter but working less harder, I have to believe my ramp up time on my traditional bike won't take that long when I do those long rides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #25 Posted January 8, 2019 9 minutes ago, donkpow said: That makes a lot of sense to me. Buy an electric bike to ride an electric bike. If you want to pedal, okay, pedal. I'd also like to see an electric bike that you could shift. I understand most people wouldn't be able to deal with it but I could. You mean like an electric shift system? If so, I was kind intrigued by it -- but then you really do have everything electric. If you're battery died, you'd be bummin' pushing a bike that's twice as heavy as your regular one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donkpow Posted January 8, 2019 Share #26 Posted January 8, 2019 11 minutes ago, Dottles said: @donkpow I won't be able to pay off these bikes until April -- but I'm glad I bought them, I've already gone on 4 rides during the holidays that I would not have normally been able to do. They are perfect for this terrain around here and coming shortly I'll be riding to and from the transit center. I do have rain gear but honestly the month of January really sucks so I may not get out there until February to do the commute thing, But it's pretty sweet knowing I got an hour's worth of riding in on a route I would have never done with a conventional bike -- in half the time. There other thing I'll be paying attention to is how well it keeps me primed for the real thing. If I am riding more during the winter but working less harder, I have to believe my ramp up time on my traditional bike won't take that long when I do those long rides. Oh I like them. The only criticism I have ever made is that it really isn't "riding a bike". I wouldn't complain any more about this than a motorcycle. 9 minutes ago, Dottles said: You mean like an electric shift system? If so, I was kind intrigued by it -- but then you really do have everything electric. If you're battery died, you'd be bummin' pushing a bike that's twice as heavy as your regular one. I mean like the motor is in the crank and you could shift manually like a regular bike. It would be like a manual transmission in a car. The problem would be how to limit torque so as not to damage the motor. Like when you stall a car motor using the wrong gear. You'd have to keep tabs on where your shifter is. You don't want to start out from a stop sign while your bike is in high gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #27 Posted January 8, 2019 4 minutes ago, donkpow said: You don't want to start out from a stop sign while your bike is in high gear. Electric motors can handle that a lot better than an internal combustion engine. You might not go anywhere if geared too high but it won’t hurt anything. Just switch to a lower gear and try again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #28 Posted January 8, 2019 7 minutes ago, donkpow said: I mean like the motor is in the crank and you could shift manually like a regular bike. It would be like a manual transmission in a car. The problem would be how to limit torque so as not to damage the motor. Like when you stall a car motor using the wrong gear. You'd have to keep tabs on where your shifter is. You don't want to start out from a stop sign while your bike is in high gear. That's exactly what I have. I just don't have the throttle mode on mine. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share #29 Posted January 8, 2019 2 minutes ago, Longjohn said: Electric motors can handle that a lot better than an internal combustion engine. You might not go anywhere if geared too high but it won’t hurt anything. Just switch to a lower gear and try again. This. My bosch mid motor works great. I try to gear down at stops. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #30 Posted January 8, 2019 9 hours ago, Dottles said: How do those front racks works for you? Since Petite must be busy working I’ll answer that. They work very well. They keep your panniers low for a low center of gravity. She had no trouble with them on the Great Adventure. My front rack is almost exactly the same but my bags are larger. If I rode too close to a rock or rut my bags would scrape a little. I think they were designed with road riding in mind and they would never scrape in road use. I didn’t see any wear on my bags from the scraping so it must have just lightly brushed enough for me to hear it. Petite’s never scraped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donkpow Posted January 8, 2019 Share #31 Posted January 8, 2019 12 minutes ago, Longjohn said: You might not go anywhere if geared too high but it won’t hurt anything. Isn't there some kind of overload protection? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #32 Posted January 8, 2019 1 minute ago, donkpow said: Isn't there some kind of overload protection? Could be, or the motor might be like an electric fan motor ( I don’t remember what there called). You can stall them out and it doesn’t hurt anything. The motors with brushes in them are the ones that burn up when stalled. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted January 8, 2019 Share #33 Posted January 8, 2019 And so much for - less serious. if you guys can’t be less serious, I’m out. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #34 Posted January 8, 2019 12 minutes ago, Kzoo said: And so much for - less serious. if you guys can’t be less serious, I’m out. When my wife passes the granddaughters they still yell out “you cheater”. Grandma laughs every time so they continue to do it. They do understand if grandma didn’t have the motor she would not be able to ride with us. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donkpow Posted January 8, 2019 Share #35 Posted January 8, 2019 14 minutes ago, Kzoo said: And so much for - less serious. if you guys can’t be less serious, I’m out. I'm pretty sure I said I liked serious comments with respect to e-bikes. ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #36 Posted January 8, 2019 12 hours ago, Dottles said: A less serious electric bike thread Can we get a more serious thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #37 Posted January 8, 2019 13 hours ago, jsharr said: Tanks You're welcome! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted January 8, 2019 Share #38 Posted January 8, 2019 I am more and more of the opinion that ebikes - using anything except public roads & private land) should HAVE to be pedal assist only AND limited to 250 watts of power. I am seeing more and more of the ebikes being poorly ridden as commuters - usually a "too safe for conditions" sort of thing, and the power of the Bosch motor in many Treks (Bosch Performance Speed, 350 watt, 63Nm, 28 mph) is bordering on irrational. Cap at 250 watts and have assisted power end at 20mph, not 28. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Page Turner Posted January 8, 2019 Share #39 Posted January 8, 2019 ...you know how at certain bike and pedestrian crowding points on a bike path, (like over at Sacramento State upriver from me,) it's smart to slow way down, because there's lots of cross traffic, entering traffic, and people walking along looking at their phones ? You don't need to do that on an e-bike. No really, none of them I see here do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted January 8, 2019 Share #40 Posted January 8, 2019 16 minutes ago, Page Turner said: You don't need to do that on an e-bike. No really, none of them I see here do. So what you're saying is that e-cyclists are giving the rest of us cyclists a bad name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Page Turner Posted January 8, 2019 Share #41 Posted January 8, 2019 1 hour ago, Kzoo said: So what you're saying is that e-cyclists are giving the rest of us cyclists a bad name. ...I prefer to think of it as "having a reputation", with all that goes along with that. After a few more fatalities start showing up in the local news here, people are gonna give us more respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted January 8, 2019 Share #42 Posted January 8, 2019 7 minutes ago, Page Turner said: ...I prefer to think of it as "having a reputation", with all that goes along with that. After a few more fatalities start showing up in the local news here, people are gonna give us more respect. I went to the funerals of my club members that died in the Kalamazoo Chain Gang killings. I was a few minutes from being one of them. We need no more deaths. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Page Turner Posted January 8, 2019 Share #43 Posted January 8, 2019 7 minutes ago, Kzoo said: I went to the funerals of my club members that died in the Kalamazoo Chain Gang killings. I was a few minutes from being one of them. We need no more deaths. ...I will copy this onto a leaflet and hand it our at the intersection of the pedestrian bridge at Sac State where it enters onto bike trails on either side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted January 8, 2019 Share #44 Posted January 8, 2019 9 minutes ago, Page Turner said: ...I will copy this onto a leaflet and hand it our at the intersection of the pedestrian bridge at Sac State where it enters onto bike trails on either side. "We need no more deaths" You can use that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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