Even brilliant, gifted

[shootingstar]

get depressed in a serious way at some point in life. Some go by suicide.

• I lost a sister by suicide who was bright, gifted and caring person. 
• Just found out a guy in my class in gr. 7-9, he must have died by suicide several yrs. ago. A close friend (who just told me this) and I used to share with him, our love of art classes in school.  He won the art award, then later graduated from CAnada's top art design college. After some years in industrial design, he worked for Pixar Studios in California.. a top animation firm that had some animation films,  won an Oscar.  Then he left.. and picked up some jobs. I really doubt he would have been happy working artistically as 1 of many animation drones in a group.  
• Friend who told me this, she admitted she had post-partum depression which she struggled a long time because she tried to hide it.  AFter all, a mother is supposed to be happy to have a cute, but demanding baby, right?  Later her hubby had a depression..a major breakdown. He takes medication. (I was shocked to learn of this.) This couple are both naturally caring individuals...they are bright, articulate  and have 3 now adult children. 

Depression is such hard, terrible thing.  And even harder when therapy can cost money. And not good, if constant medication is thought to be a solution.  

I'm biased because I underwent intensive counselling therapy myself for 1 yr. during university. I know how hard it is to even get out of bed to face the day. How critical it is to find and work with the right counsellor.

[shootingstar]

So no one here has ever  had a mentally shitty time in life? 

[Airehead]

Being bright can be the reason for depression.  I am not even sure how you could hint at surprise the bright people cannot suffer depression.  I have had plenty of mentally shitty times.   Married a year to a guy with three kids. Pancreatic cancer does him in. Little girls now have lost mom and dad burp, that will make you a little depressed if you already have that biological tendency. Should I go on?

[ChrisL]

I take your post title to imply surprise that smart people can get depressed?  Anyone can suffer from it.

Depression runs in my family but it doesn’t affect me personally. I get pissed off sometimes and sad when family dies but I have never felt depressed for long periods of time.  I have been blessed with a fairly care free happy disposition.

[Airehead]

3 minutes ago, ChrisL said:

I take your post title to imply surprise that smart people can get depressed?  Anyone can suffer from it.

Depression runs in my family but it doesn’t affect me personally. I get pissed off sometimes and sad when family dies but I have never felt depressed for long periods of time.  I have been blessed with a fairly care free happy disposition.

Runs in my family too. My great grandfather had an episode and shot and killed all of his family except my grandmother who was out courting my grandfather at the time. So his wife and eight kids. Then he threw himself in front of a train. My grandmother seemed to not suffer from  it but my mother did. 

[Scrapr ★]

WoScrapr sister has been hospitalized several times. It's awful. The medicine changes the brain chemistry. After a while the brain adapts to the medicine and changes some more. Which leads her to suicidal thoughts. And the Dr change the "cocktail" some more. But...it takes months to tell if it's working. The most heartbreaking was when we were with her on the ward. She was telling us about the voices telling her to kill herself. She will be fine for months & months. Then the chemistry changes. If she is lucky they get ahead of the changes & she stays out of the hospital. It's not a static thing like take this pill every day & you are good

[Airehead]

2 minutes ago, Scrapr said:

WoScrapr sister has been hospitalized several times. It's awful. The medicine changes the brain chemistry. After a while the brain adapts to the medicine and changes some more. Which leads her to suicidal thoughts. And the Dr change the "cocktail" some more. But...it takes months to tell if it's working. The most heartbreaking was when we were with her on the ward. She was telling us about the voices telling her to kill herself. She will be fine for months & months. Then the chemistry changes. If she is lucky they get ahead of the changes & she stays out of the hospital. It's not a static thing like take this pill every day & you are good

Agreed

[Further]

Robin Williams   

[shootingstar]

1 hour ago, Scrapr said:

WoScrapr sister has been hospitalized several times. It's awful. The medicine changes the brain chemistry. After a while the brain adapts to the medicine and changes some more. Which leads her to suicidal thoughts. And the Dr change the "cocktail" some more. But...it takes months to tell if it's working. The most heartbreaking was when we were with her on the ward. She was telling us about the voices telling her to kill herself. She will be fine for months & months. Then the chemistry changes. If she is lucky they get ahead of the changes & she stays out of the hospital. It's not a static thing like take this pill every day & you are good

Because my sister was a pharmacist, she really didn't want to go the drug therapy route.  And we never saw our sister as having some sort of long term psychiatric disorder at all. I viewed her as struggling with long term post partum depression....she became a full-time mother and seemed to lose confidence in herself.  

My niece (her daughter) went through several years, of which some was the result of losing her mother.  She did undergo several different therapies, including electroshock.  In the end, she figured she was treatment resistant and got off the route. Now she's writing rom-coms and happier. She abandoned her geological engineering career route . (That's what she completed her university degree.) She does take a mild sleeping pill in evening. It's been a long hard route. I'm happy for her and support her as someone from the....Asian side of her family and also on the literary side since it's probably easiest for her to mention her writing to me, given my natural orientation in the arts.

With the loss of her mother, then in a way, I've stepped in to tell her over time, the stories and family history that make up her mother's side...

Suicide can affect various family members ...profoundly. 

I know the friend's hubby who is on lithium..I've knew the guy long before all this.  I get abit concerned when I hear diagnosis, labels, like bipolar, etc.  He never "labelled" this untiil his 40's. I think it was the perceived societal pressure of finding paid work to support his family that played on his mind.  He has a Phd...in English Lit.  So does my close friend, who did experience post-partum depression.  So I know this couple personally enough.

I personally feel lucky....not to have gone the drug therapy route.  The counselling helped me turn around and helped me regain self-confidence to make some major personal changes.  During that time, with closest friends, I just wanted them to treat as me I always was....normal, but just sadder during that time period. I still wanted them to believe ...in me..the very best parts of me.

 

 

[Prophet Zacharia]

5 minutes ago, shootingstar said:

I get abit concerned when I hear diagnosis, labels, like bipolar,

You mean because it’s a terrible illness? Or some other reason?

[shootingstar]

9 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

You mean because it’s a terrible illness? Or some other reason?

I think a certain % of it, drugs can be avoided for some people.  It's finding the right counsellor, not psychiatrist. Very good counselling can be intense and takes time. Pyschiatrists tend to recommend drugs, because they have the medical degree.

 

[Zephyr]

Some depressions are in the mind, and with good therapy can be dealt with, but in a lot of cases, like scaper mentioned, it is due to a chemical imbalance and the greatest therapists in the world will not fix it.  That would be like seeing a therapist to try to deal with your diabetes because you do not want to take drugs.  Over the years I have dealt with thousands of mentally ill people, most of whom just need their meds adjusted to be righted again.  

There is no shame in taking meds for mental health

[JerrySTL ★]

4 minutes ago, Zephyr said:

Some depressions are in the mind, and with good therapy can be dealt with, but in a lot of cases, like scaper mentioned, it is due to a chemical imbalance and the greatest therapists in the world will not fix it.  That would be like seeing a therapist to try to deal with your diabetes because you do not want to take drugs.  Over the years I have dealt with thousands of mentally ill people, most of whom just need their meds adjusted to be righted again.  

There is no shame in taking meds for mental health

I saw a psychiatrist when I was 11 years old. I was what would now be called hyperactive or ADHD. I drove my parents and teachers crazy. Had I been born 40 years later, I'd probably would have been heavily medicated. Instead my doctor had my parents and teachers keep me physically and mentally busy with things that I enjoyed doing. I'm glad that I was able to work through my issues without being medicated as there seems to be too many kids medicated now days.

[maddmaxx ★]

Every time I start to get depressed I come to the decision that I should enjoy it.

[MickinMD ★]

There have been times in my life when things looked bad and I was mentally in a very dark place, but I always had enough self-confidence that I expected things would eventually get better and life would become fun again and devoid of the serious worries plaguing me at the time.  So I've never considered suicide.

I've known acquaintances, none close, who died by suicide and in each case they had reached a point where they expected the rest of their lives would be full of constant sorrow - either because of financial or physical or disease problems.  I've also known a few people who died in old age because they had gotten tired of fighting an illness that was terminal and lost the desire to keep fighting it.  My father died of cancer and failing-organs and suffered for half a year of serious decline. His last words, made with a clear mind, were, "I think it's time to check out."

I can understand people committing suicide to end suffering and maybe would do the same myself if it was bad enough, but I don't understand though I do feel sorry for those do it because of something they could have potentially overcome but gave up.

Those who do it because of drug problems are in a different class because you don't know how their normal behavior might have been influenced by the drugs.

[shootingstar]

8 minutes ago, JerrySTL said:

I saw a psychiatrist when I was 11 years old. I was what would now be called hyperactive or ADHD. I drove my parents and teachers crazy. Had I been born 40 years later, I'd probably would have been heavily medicated. Instead my doctor had my parents and teachers keep me physically and mentally busy with things that I enjoyed doing. I'm glad that I was able to work through my issues without being medicated as there seems to be too many kids medicated now days.

I agree. At work, 1 of colleagues is currently dealing with her 5 yr. old son this. He set a fire....twice on top of all this.  

 

22 minutes ago, Zephyr said:

Some depressions are in the mind, and with good therapy can be dealt with, but in a lot of cases, like scaper mentioned, it is due to a chemical imbalance and the greatest therapists in the world will not fix it.  That would be like seeing a therapist to try to deal with your diabetes because you do not want to take drugs.  Over the years I have dealt with thousands of mentally ill people, most of whom just need their meds adjusted to be righted again.  

There is no shame in taking meds for mental health

It's more about how some drugs can affect the brain in a negative way, as Scrapr describes.

[ChrisL]

3 minutes ago, JerrySTL said:

I saw a psychiatrist when I was 11 years old. I was what would now be called hyperactive or ADHD. I drove my parents and teachers crazy. Had I been born 40 years later, I'd probably would have been heavily medicated. Instead my doctor had my parents and teachers keep me physically and mentally busy with things that I enjoyed doing. I'm glad that I was able to work through my issues without being medicated as there seems to be too many kids medicated now days.

I had a teacher tell us our son was ADHD & needed to be medicated.  He’s “outside the box”  she said. Dr’s said he’s not Add/ADHD.

I honestly feel that teacher was counting the years to retirement and didn’t want to deal with him.  BTW 2 years later he was tested as GATE and low & behold all of his behavior issues went away in GATE...

[Scrapr ★]

1 minute ago, ChrisL said:

I had a teacher tell us our son was ADHD & needed to be medicated.  He’s “outside the box”  she said. Dr’s said he’s not Add/ADHD.

I honestly feel that teacher was counting the years to retirement and didn’t want to deal with him.  BTW 2 years later he was tested as GATE and low & behold all of his behavior issues went away in GATE...

So it only took his teacher 2 years to cure him? Did she hold him back a year so she could work w/him longer?

[shootingstar]

9 minutes ago, ChrisL said:

I had a teacher tell us our son was ADHD & needed to be medicated.  He’s “outside the box”  she said. Dr’s said he’s not Add/ADHD.

I honestly feel that teacher was counting the years to retirement and didn’t want to deal with him.  BTW 2 years later he was tested as GATE and low & behold all of his behavior issues went away in GATE...

What is GATE?

[ChrisL]

Just now, shootingstar said:

What is GATE?

Gifted And Talented.

[ChrisL]

1 minute ago, Scrapr said:

So it only took his teacher 2 years to cure him? Did she hold him back a year so she could work w/him longer?

That was 2nd grade. He had a different teacher, much younger and worked with him better for 3rd grade but she still struggled with his behavior. But to her credit she had the foresight to have him tested. He started GATE for 4th - 8th grade.

[shootingstar]

2 hours ago, Airehead said:

Runs in my family too. My great grandfather had an episode and shot and killed all of his family except my grandmother who was out courting my grandfather at the time. So his wife and eight kids. Then he threw himself in front of a train. My grandmother seemed to not suffer from  it but my mother did. 

I wouldn't say it runs in my family.  A cousin's husband died by suicide in Toronto by jumping off a road bridge. He left 2 young children.  

It's not easy to tell others that one has suicide in a family. Nobody at work knows and don't intend to tell anyone. My friends are respectful but they never ask about my sister or if I mention her, they kinda drift away from the topic. I just think they can't quite comprehend this type of loss. And all of these friends have excellent relationships with their sibs.

Actually for the friend with her medicated hubby, she is the closest I've felt re my sister, since she is willing to talk about such problems.  Yes, she met my sister several times in the past.

And I forgot, I didn't know of close friend's father who died by suicide until I told her about my sis.

 

[Zephyr]

There are probably more people you know with suicide in their family than you realize.  It is quite a common occurence 

[ChrisL]

4 minutes ago, Zephyr said:

There are probably more people you know with suicide in their family than you realize.  It is quite a common occurence 

I didn’t post it earlier but 1 uncle & 2 nephews. A third nephew was killed by police but I’m thinking it was suicide by cop.  He was a drug addict & not a violent criminal until the shooting.

[Prophet Zacharia]

2 hours ago, shootingstar said:

I think a certain % of it, drugs can be avoided for some people.  It's finding the right counsellor, not psychiatrist. Very good counselling can be intense and takes time. Pyschiatrists tend to recommend drugs, because they have the medical degree.

 

It’s unwise for people with Bipolar disorder to stop taking medication. It’s an illness with up to 20% suicide rate. While it’s personal preference whether one use medication, therapy or a combination for mild to moderate depression, severe unipolar major depression and bipolar disorders should absolutely use a combination approach. I’d compare advocating against this as being akin to saying cancer should only be treated with homeopathic approaches, not medications. It’s the same issue.

[Airehead]

10 hours ago, Prophet Zacharia said:

It’s unwise for people with Bipolar disorder to stop taking medication. It’s an illness with up to 20% suicide rate. While it’s personal preference whether one use medication, therapy or a combination for mild to moderate depression, severe unipolar major depression and bipolar disorders should absolutely use a combination approach. I’d compare advocating against this as being akin to saying cancer should only be treated with homeopathic approaches, not medications. It’s the same issue.

So much truth. Holds true for other mental illnesses as well.   Would you say, Just snap out of that schizophrenia?  How can you be sad with that cute baby?  Women with significant postpartum depression kill their children and themselves without  skilled treatment. Until we, as a community, treat and fund  mental illnesses in the way we treat other debilitating illnesses, people will die needlessly.  You  have so much to live for— doesn’t count it as quality treatment.