12string Posted March 21, 2022 Share #1 Posted March 21, 2022 The news reports are just saying there's nothing left of the plane, I just watched a cell phone video from a friend of a friend in China. Showed the plane headed straight into the ground, at almost 90 degrees, note spinning or tumbling. What say ye, Wilbur? Is that even a thing? Or Deep fake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airehead Posted March 21, 2022 Share #2 Posted March 21, 2022 And at about 8,000 feet per minute is the talk I heard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted March 21, 2022 Share #3 Posted March 21, 2022 I can't tell from that video if the wings were still intact or not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted March 21, 2022 Share #4 Posted March 21, 2022 It is on video. I will act like the TSB and you all act like the media. Here goes: This has every indication of a loss of control accident. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerrySTL ★ Posted March 21, 2022 Share #5 Posted March 21, 2022 There's very few things that can cause an aircraft to nose straight down like that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 21, 2022 Share #6 Posted March 21, 2022 50 minutes ago, JerrySTL said: There's very few things that can cause an aircraft to nose straight down like that. Gravity 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 21, 2022 Share #7 Posted March 21, 2022 I heard dropped at 30,000 feet per minute Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted March 21, 2022 Share #8 Posted March 21, 2022 very sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airehead Posted March 21, 2022 Share #9 Posted March 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Wilbur said: It is on video. I will act like the TSB and you all act like the media. Here goes: This has every indication of a loss of control accident. Question—- I am Airehead from Talking Heads TV. Loss of control, sounds serious. Was it? Is this common? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted March 21, 2022 Share #10 Posted March 21, 2022 18 minutes ago, Airehead said: Question—- I am Airehead from Talking Heads TV. Loss of control, sounds serious. Was it? Is this common? Yes, because if they had control, they would not have hit the ground. Unless of course, crazy pilot. That seems to be on the rise. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerrySTL ★ Posted March 21, 2022 Share #11 Posted March 21, 2022 Just now, Wilbur said: Yes, because if they had control, they would not have hit the ground. Unless of course, crazy pilot. That seems to be on the rise. From the flight profile it looks like they may have stalled; pulled up after a while; then stalled again. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickinMD ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #12 Posted March 22, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Square Wheels Posted March 22, 2022 Share #13 Posted March 22, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #14 Posted March 22, 2022 14 hours ago, JerrySTL said: From the flight profile it looks like they may have stalled; pulled up after a while; then stalled again. Yeah, don't know what happened there. I suspect an in-flight break up. I don't see an empennage in the video. Don't know if they had a catastrophic failure or perhaps terrorism. The earlier 737-300 and 400 had issues with rudder bias systems that caused control issues and the loss of two or three airframes. The 800 does not have MCAS so that is out. We will see. It may still be a psychotic episode. Who knows? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #15 Posted March 22, 2022 8 minutes ago, Wilbur said: Yeah, don't know what happened there. I suspect an in-flight break up. I don't see an empennage in the video. Don't know if they had a catastrophic failure or perhaps terrorism. The earlier 737-300 and 400 had issues with rudder bias systems that caused control issues and the loss of two or three airframes. The 800 does not have MCAS so that is out. We will see. It may still be a psychotic episode. Who knows? I am thinking terror or crazed flight crew. This is only like the 10th fatal incident with that plane and experts are saying one has never just fallen from the sky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #16 Posted March 22, 2022 3 minutes ago, jsharrwick said: I am thinking terror or crazed flight crew. This is only like the 10th fatal incident with that plane and experts are saying one has never just fallen from the sky. The rudder bias accidents were very much like that so the "experts" aren't being totally honest. They tend to happen when maneuvering though and there were a couple of AD's to address it. It is very difficult to achieve a near perfectly vertical dive without either intent, or a missing tail section. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #17 Posted March 22, 2022 1 minute ago, Wilbur said: The rudder bias accidents were very much like that so the "experts" aren't being totally honest. Jsharr can't tell a lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #18 Posted March 22, 2022 1 minute ago, Razors Edge said: Jsharr can't tell a lie. I would never accuse him of doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #19 Posted March 22, 2022 2 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: Jsharr can't tell a lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #20 Posted March 22, 2022 28 minutes ago, Wilbur said: I would never accuse him of doing so. Since he is definitively one of our resident "experts", you came mighty close with that "aren't being totally honest" bit. He is probably licking his wounds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #21 Posted March 22, 2022 Just now, Razors Edge said: Since he is definitively one of our resident "experts", you came mighty close with that "aren't being totally honest" bit. He is probably licking his wounds lets get back to talking about the plane crash please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #22 Posted March 22, 2022 Just now, jsharrwick said: lets get back to talking about the plane crash please. Well, give us your HONEST opinion this time, sir! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #23 Posted March 22, 2022 5 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: Well, give us your HONEST opinion this time, sir! I think someone crashed it. I think Wilbur knows the tail broke off, but we don't know why. I think it is a horrible loss of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #24 Posted March 22, 2022 Just now, jsharrwick said: I think it is a horrible loss of life. That's a given. Sadly, that's a given pretty much across the board for death - expected and unexpected Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted March 22, 2022 Share #25 Posted March 22, 2022 13 minutes ago, jsharrwick said: I think someone crashed it. So a suicidal pilot/flight crew, or a terroristic intervention? Didn’t a Lufthansa flight crash in the Alps under similar circumstances? IIRC that was pilot suicide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #26 Posted March 22, 2022 Just now, Prophet Zacharia said: So a suicidal pilot/flight crew, or a terroristic intervention? Didn’t a Lufthansa flight crash in the Alps under similar circumstances? IIRC that was pilot suicide. Pilot or flight crew is what I am thinking. Not sure why, but when I saw the images of the jet going straight down, I thought, "that just does not happen on it's own" I bet in the long run Wilbur is right and the tail came off, for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prophet Zacharia Posted March 22, 2022 Share #27 Posted March 22, 2022 13 minutes ago, jsharrwick said: images of the jet going straight down I just got the video to load, it was way worse an image than I imagined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #28 Posted March 22, 2022 2 minutes ago, Prophet Zacharia said: I just got the video to load, it was way worse an image than I imagined. Very unsettling to think 132 people were inside that plane. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerrySTL ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #29 Posted March 22, 2022 2 hours ago, Wilbur said: Yeah, don't know what happened there. I suspect an in-flight break up. I don't see an empennage in the video. Don't know if they had a catastrophic failure or perhaps terrorism. The earlier 737-300 and 400 had issues with rudder bias systems that caused control issues and the loss of two or three airframes. The 800 does not have MCAS so that is out. We will see. It may still be a psychotic episode. Who knows? I remember reading and seeing a show about the rudder issues. There's a Wikipedia page on it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_737_rudder_issues 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #30 Posted March 22, 2022 10 minutes ago, JerrySTL said: I remember reading and seeing a show about the rudder issues. There's a Wikipedia page on it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_737_rudder_issues And a report that the problems might still be present: Times Daily - Google News Archive Search 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeman564™ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #31 Posted March 22, 2022 2 hours ago, Wilbur said: The rudder bias accidents were very much like that so the "experts" aren't being totally honest. They tend to happen when maneuvering though and there were a couple of AD's to address it. It is very difficult to achieve a near perfectly vertical dive without either intent, or a missing tail section. I find your airplane knowledge fascinating 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerrySTL ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #32 Posted March 22, 2022 3 hours ago, Wilbur said: It is very difficult to achieve a near perfectly vertical dive without either intent, or a missing tail section. It just occurred to me that the wings would still provide lift even in a vertical dive which would tend to gradually pull the aircraft from vertical unless someone was forcing the aircraft down or the aircraft was corkscrewing / spinning. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Wilbur ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Popular Post Share #33 Posted March 22, 2022 1 hour ago, bikeman564™ said: I find your airplane knowledge fascinating 40 years into it, something has to stick, right? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeman564™ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #34 Posted March 22, 2022 6 minutes ago, Wilbur said: 40 years into it, something has to stick, right? yup. I find flying, along with other complicated things, interesting. From the physics involved to what you pilots have to know and calculate to make a flight. I've watched some you tube videos about pre-flight preparations. I'm impressed. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted March 22, 2022 Share #35 Posted March 22, 2022 26 minutes ago, Wilbur said: 40 years into it, something has to stick, right? 40 years into it and it all starts slipping away. At lease that's what Maxi says... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #36 Posted March 22, 2022 6 minutes ago, Kzoo said: 40 years into it and it all starts slipping away. At lease that's what Maxi says... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted March 22, 2022 Share #37 Posted March 22, 2022 10 minutes ago, Kzoo said: 40 years into it and it all starts slipping away. At lease that's what Maxi says... I saw what you did there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12string Posted March 22, 2022 Author Share #38 Posted March 22, 2022 1 hour ago, JerrySTL said: It just occurred to me that the wings would still provide lift even in a vertical dive which would tend to gradually pull the aircraft from vertical unless someone was forcing the aircraft down or the aircraft was corkscrewing / spinning. The video I saw, it was definitely not corkscrewing or spinning. Other than the 90 degree horizon, It looked normal flight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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