Pride Night

[ChrisL]

We went to an Angels game last night as they played the Cubs, my sons favorite team. By coincidence it was also Pride night.  

Interesting to me that any drama was at the parking lot entrances where religious groups with PA’s & signs were calling us all sinners for supporting an organization who supports LBGT.  They were rabid and calling out certain individuals by their dress and getting into vicious name calling (I won’t mention the derogatory terms but really nasty verbiage) with them.  The participants mainly ignored them and went on their way. 

We thought it may get interesting inside but once we got into the stadium it was like any other game with zero drama.  I actually forgot it was Pride Night.

The name calling & taunts just didn’t seem like something a truly religious person would do.  It just seemed to me they were pushing hate speech under the color of religion.  

[Wilbur ★]

3 minutes ago, ChrisL said:

 It just seemed to me they were pushing hate speech

It is the new national pastime. 

 

[Dirtyhip]

This is a sad point in history, IMO.  

[BR46]

9 minutes ago, Dirtyhip said:

This is a sad point in history, IMO.  

Divide and conquer is the way of the world. 

[Wilbur ★]

The best thing the LGB community could do is distance itself from the T.   The days of questioning gays were gone.  The public has largely accepted it. The religious right will never accept the trans doctrine being pushed these days with all the gender pronoun stuff.  People are pushing back and I don't see it ending well.  But then, I grew up in the biology-based terms of gender.  I personally don't care what people do, as long as I am not having to pay the price. Live and let live but don't step on me for not buying into your fantasy.   

So, it is sad but even sadder is it has become another lefty-righty division.  

[MoseySusan]

22 minutes ago, ChrisL said:

We went to an Angels game last night as they played the Cubs, my sons favorite team.

My BiL and SiL were also there. Big Cubs fans. 

4 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

personally don't care what people do, as long as I am not having to pay the price. Live and let live

This is exactly what the majority of transgender and gender non-conforming people are asking. Just let me be. 

[BR46]

20 minutes ago, MoseySusan said:

This is exactly what the majority of transgender and gender non-conforming people are asking. Just let me be. 

This...

Just try being happy in your own world and don't worry about people who don't agree with you. 

[Thaddeus Kosciuszko]

46 minutes ago, ChrisL said:

Interesting to me that any drama was at the parking lot entrances where religious groups with PA’s & signs were calling us all sinners...

The name calling & taunts just didn’t seem like something a truly religious person would do.

It wouldn't seem so, but some religions draw a red line when you're a Cubs fan...

[ChrisL]

43 minutes ago, MoseySusan said:

My BiL and SiL were also there. Big Cubs fans. 

Did they mention the protestors outside the fence?  I like to park by the entry/exit on Orangewood Blvd and that’s where I saw them.  There could have been more.

Ever since he was a kid my son connected with my wife’s younger brother. My son really is his mini me. So my BIL took a job in Chicago after college & became a big Cubs fan.  Still is. Well for some reason my son took an interest in the Cubs as well not even knowing his uncle is a huge fan. 

[groupw]

58 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

The best thing the LGB community could do is distance itself from the T.   The days of questioning gays were gone.  The public has largely accepted it. The religious right will never accept the trans doctrine being pushed these days with all the gender pronoun stuff.  People are pushing back and I don't see it ending well.  But then, I grew up in the biology-based terms of gender.  I personally don't care what people do, as long as I am not having to pay the price. Live and let live but don't step on me for not buying into your fantasy.   

So, it is sad but even sadder is it has become another lefty-righty division.  

It wasn’t all that long ago that the other letters were just as big an issue. However as more and more respected people came out, much of society (and I myself) have evolved in their thinking. I grew up in a very homophobic culture. But as I met more and more people who were one of the letters above, I learned they are just people and the labels didn’t matter. 
Since moving out here, I have met 2 “T’s”. One I worked closely with for a time. She and I share a warped sense of humor. I don’t know which restroom they use. Nor does it matter. I’ve met more horrible people who shun these people than those using one of the letters. 

[Wilbur ★]

36 minutes ago, groupw said:

It wasn’t all that long ago that the other letters were just as big an issue. However as more and more respected people came out, much of society (and I myself) have evolved in their thinking. I grew up in a very homophobic culture. But as I met more and more people who were one of the letters above, I learned they are just people and the labels didn’t matter. 
Since moving out here, I have met 2 “T’s”. One I worked closely with for a time. She and I share a warped sense of humor. I don’t know which restroom they use. Nor does it matter. I’ve met more horrible people who shun these people than those using one of the letters. 

We have two family friends with transgendered kids and I have a niece that is.  I treat everyone with respect but I never feel obliged to acquiesce to their demands on pro-nouns because that is just nonsense.  You do you, but don't force you on me.  

[Bikeguy]

2 hours ago, ChrisL said:

the Cubs, my sons favorite team.

2 hours ago, BR46 said:

Divide and conquer is the way of the world.

Yeah... in the Chicago area there are Cubs fans and White Sox fans.   The two groups are mutually exclusive.   They are very divided... 

Wrigley Field is a much nicer place for a ball game.  

 

[groupw]

1 hour ago, Wilbur said:

We have two family friends with transgendered kids and I have a niece that is.  I treat everyone with respect but I never feel obliged to acquiesce to their demands on pro-nouns because that is just nonsense.  You do you, but don't force you on me.  

I’m just sharing my observations. Not sure what I’m forcing on you. 

[Wilbur ★]

10 minutes ago, groupw said:

I’m just sharing my observations. Not sure what I’m forcing on you. 

Not you sir.  Maybe I should have said "They do they"  

[groupw]

44 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

Not you sir.  Maybe I should have said "They do they"  

I’ve never had any pronouns other than if they were now a female to say she/her or guy to say he/him. If someone requests another, I’ll do my best. We sometimes say they/them without it being a whole “identity” issue and we don’t realize it. I’ll do my best to respect them. 

[Prophet Zacharia]

2 hours ago, groupw said:

It wasn’t all that long ago that the other letters were just as big an issue. However as more and more respected people came out, much of society (and I myself) have evolved in their thinking. I grew up in a very homophobic culture. But as I met more and more people who were one of the letters above, I learned they are just people and the labels didn’t matter. 
Since moving out here, I have met 2 “T’s”. One I worked closely with for a time. She and I share a warped sense of humor. I don’t know which restroom they use. Nor does it matter. I’ve met more horrible people who shun these people than those using one of the letters. 

I’ve worked with a fair number of transgender people over the years. While I can never fully understand what it feels like to believe you are not your identified birth gender, I can empathize that it must be a difficult process of self-discovery. I’m willing to show that I respect them to use whatever name or pronoun they identify with. It doesn’t impact me in any way to do so. Not to be dismissive, but I don’t care, so I’ll honor their preferences.
 

 

[ChrisL]

2 hours ago, Bikeguy said:

Yeah... in the Chicago area there are Cubs fans and White Sox fans.   The two groups are mutually exclusive.   They are very divided... 

Wrigley Field is a much nicer place for a ball game.  

LA is similar in that you have Dodger fans and then there are Dodger fans… Oh yeah and a handful of Angel fans.

A few weeks back the LA news networks showed highlights of the Dodger win and yet fails to mention Mike Trout breaking a HR record held by Joe DiMaggio… Yeah sucks being an Angel fan in Dodger town…

[Ralphie ★]

What is wrong with people?

[maddmaxx ★]

[Razors Edge ★]

14 hours ago, ChrisL said:

The name calling & taunts just didn’t seem like something a truly religious person would do.  It just seemed to me they were pushing hate speech under the color of religion.  

"Religious"? Sure.  Religion is a big umbrella.

But in context of "Christian"?  Hell no. WWJD is absolutely the opposite of those bigots.  Jesus would welcome and comfort the whole range of the alphabet - LGBTxyz and even plain old S .   

[Kzoo]

1 hour ago, Razors Edge said:

Jesus would welcome and comfort 

Or maybe love and chastize?  Are you forgetting the Samaritan woman that the well?

 

[Razors Edge ★]

Just now, Kzoo said:

Or maybe love and chastize?  Are you forgetting the Samaritan woman that the well?

Chastise what? Being human?

[MoseySusan]

3 hours ago, Razors Edge said:

 Jesus would welcome and comfort

The Roman centurion who appealed to Jesus to have mercy on his manservant is often cited as the example. Jesus didn’t question the intimate relationship between the two; it didn’t even come up or figure into the conversation. Jesus just commended the Roman man’s faith and healed his companion. Historians frequently comment that the Centurion and his servant were assuredly in a physical relationship, and the man’s love is evident in his appeal. Nobody wants to have to answer for every personal choice in their life. We want to live, to flourish. 

[Randomguy]

18 hours ago, ChrisL said:

It just seemed to me they were pushing hate speech under the color of religion.  

You know I hate to pile on, but that seems to be religion's main point these days.  It was probably always that way, but you just don't notice it when growing up as much.

[Wilbur ★]

13 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

You know I hate to pile on, but that seems to be religion's main point these days.  It was probably always that way, but you just don't notice it when growing up as much.

I think some denominations are far worse than others for that and perhaps it varies from country to country.  I grew up in a protestant family and the church always led the way in inclusion, often long before society on the whole. 

[Razors Edge ★]

2 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

I think some denominations are far worse than others for that

100% true.  I know many many many good folks of religious and non-religious persuasions.  

Some of the worst folks have forever used religion as a shield for atrocious behavior.  The main faiths of the world are way too broad in scope and membership to call out any as monolithic supporters of hate. I do think, though, that members of a specific faith should do what they can to remove the bad apples from their ranks. Easier said than done, though, and difficult if you're also trying to welcome folks & help them become better humans.

[Wilbur ★]

2 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

 I know many many many good folks of religious and non-religious persuasions.

I know a lot more good than bad for sure.  Society isn't totally in the tank as some would have you believe.  

[Randomguy]

1 minute ago, Wilbur said:

I know a lot more g/ood than bad for sure.  Society isn't totally in the tank as some would have you believe.  

I think it is more of the  60/40 kind of thing, with 60% of religious folks being truly reprehensible in almost every way, 20% mostly shitty but with some redeemable qualities, and 10% pretty decent, and 10% exemplary individuals.  All behave badly or don't fuss or make noise over horrible suggestion/behaviors in the group setting though, no religion policies itself in a meaningful way.  To be fair, though, all groups are horrible in multiple ways, not just the god-squad or the highway types.  I don't think much of our species as a whole.

[jsharr ★]

17 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

I know a lot more good than bad for sure.  Society isn't totally in the tank as some would have you believe.  

[Wilbur ★]

7 minutes ago, Randomguy said:

I think it is more of the  60/40 kind of thing, with 60% of religious folks being truly reprehensible in almost every way, 20% mostly shitty but with some redeemable qualities, and 10% pretty decent, and 10% exemplary individuals.  All behave badly or don't fuss or make noise over horrible suggestion/behaviors in the group setting though, no religion policies itself in a meaningful way.  To be fair, though, all groups are horrible in multiple ways, not just the god-squad or the highway types.  I don't think much of our species as a whole.

Wowilbur was watching a program on the Dugger? family the other day.  They are in a very cultish religion and many kids within the organization claim to have been sex slaves for cult leadership.  Now the father has taken over the flock.  Yes there are screwed up religious types and screwed up non-believers. 

[Razors Edge ★]

Just now, jsharr said:

An interesting thought on that photo.  If they're all "straight", no one would complain. If some of them are "gay or bi" the crickets start chirping. If any are "trans", it turns into a firestorm of hate & fear.

Sure, that's "better" than a decade or several decades ago, but a clear sign that progress still needs to be made.