Kzoo Posted November 3, 2016 Share #201 Posted November 3, 2016 5 minutes ago, Amadeus said: It was not a good fit for this site any longer and it was running over into the other sections. I'd prefer no one leave, but we no longer offer an avenue to discuss politics or religion. It rarely ends and even more rarely, ends well. Truer words never spoken. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onbike1939 Posted November 3, 2016 Share #202 Posted November 3, 2016 4 minutes ago, Wilbur said: It may not be heart warming, but it is the reality of the internet. Well this is of course true as is the fact that the owner of the site does have the prerogative here and rightly so. What however is disturbing is the way it was done and the subsequent posts telling those who queried this to leave the forum in a manner best described as tribal. In the eyes of these posters it seems that those who posted in P&R were no longer fellow members it seems but the "others", or in other words "incomers" and treated as such. Disappointing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtyhip Posted November 3, 2016 Share #203 Posted November 3, 2016 11 minutes ago, Amadeus said: It was not a good fit for this site any longer and it was running over into the other sections. I'd prefer no one leave, but we no longer offer an avenue to discuss politics or religion. It rarely ends and even more rarely, ends well. Politics are a heated subject. What was it that made you shut it down? People calling each other names? Threats? I think that when you over regulate a forum, you stop progressive speech. It was already segregated. During voting time, having an avenue for that is even more important. Life is not all butterflies and rainbows. It can be ugly, sexist, angry, and all those bad things. Ugly is the yin to the yang of beauty. Maybe it is the other way around. Whatever. You said if people don't like it, they can leave, but you don't want people to leave. Opening a second URL, is not the answer. People aren't going to check all kinds of different sites. Which is why the bicycling specific rooms are dead. You have to go back to the main page and open them, and then go back to the off topic to open this one. I find that cumbersome. I end up posting about bike things in here. The other places are ghost towns. Maybe we don't have enough traffic for tons of rooms. And you just killed one that was gaining some steam. Butterflies and rainbows get a little boring day in and day out. Bring on the thunder. Where is @Randomguy ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Square Wheels Posted November 3, 2016 Author Share #204 Posted November 3, 2016 10 minutes ago, onbike1939 said: What however is disturbing is the way it was done and the subsequent posts telling those who queried this to leave the forum in a manner best described as tribal. In the eyes of these posters it seems that those who posted in P&R were no longer fellow members it seems but the "others", or in other words "incomers" and treated as such. Please point out to me where I said anyone was not welcome? I understand that something important to a few people was taken away and it upset them, for this I am sorry. Again, it was decided that P&R was not a good fit. Should I have said, hey, next Wednesday this section will be closed? I don't see what good that would have done. It was not my intention to cause hard feelings between me and anyone, I apologize if this has happened. P&R will not come back here. I have offered to start another site that can be all P&R and it can be started with those posts we already have. There would close to no rules and you can pick your own moderators, no one has taken me up on that offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Page Turner Posted November 3, 2016 Share #205 Posted November 3, 2016 9 minutes ago, onbike1939 said: What however is disturbing is the way it was done and the subsequent posts telling those who queried this to leave the forum in a manner best described as tribal. In the eyes of these posters it seems that those who posted in P&R were no longer fellow members it seems but the "others", or in other words "incomers" and treated as such. Disappointing. I feel threatened by the new people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onbike1939 Posted November 3, 2016 Share #206 Posted November 3, 2016 3 minutes ago, Amadeus said: Please point out to me where I said anyone was not welcome? I understand that something important to a few people was taken away and it upset them, for this I am sorry. Again, it was decided that P&R was not a good fit. Should I have said, hey, next Wednesday this section will be closed? I don't see what good that would have done. It was not my intention to cause hard feelings between me and anyone, I apologize if this has happened. P&R will not come back here. I have offered to start another site that can be all P&R and it can be started with those posts we already have. There would close to no rules and you can pick your own moderators, no one has taken me up on that offer. I'm not sure why you think that I was referring to you. No...it was remarks such as this I was talking about and repeated remarks at that. 17 hours ago, AirwickWithCheese said: Again this is why it simply will not work for you guys. Everything is not political and moreover no one wants to constantly hear your political opinions. If you can't make your very own P & R forum work here, leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onbike1939 Posted November 3, 2016 Share #207 Posted November 3, 2016 8 minutes ago, Page Turner said: I feel threatened by the new people And with good reason I might add. It appears from the various popularity polls held in this forum that you are held in low repute....oh yes....your gas is already at a peep here. It follows then that the arrival of a cohort of highly gifted individuals is not going to do you one bit of good Sweetpants. Not that I don't want to help....have you tried posting a few photos of you naked but for your Fire Service galluses? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Square Wheels Posted November 3, 2016 Author Share #208 Posted November 3, 2016 12 minutes ago, onbike1939 said: I'm not sure why you think that I was referring to you. My fault, since it was my decision to remove P&R, I presumed the comments were directed at me. @AirwickWithCheese feels very strongly about this site, however the decision was all mine. I know some will leave over this, but our doors are always open if they decide to return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Square Wheels Posted November 3, 2016 Author Share #209 Posted November 3, 2016 21 minutes ago, Dirtyhip said: You have to go back to the main page and open them, and then go back to the off topic to open this one. There is a much better option, use the Unread Content link on every page. http://squarewheelscycling.com/index.php?/discover/unread/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onbike1939 Posted November 3, 2016 Share #210 Posted November 3, 2016 1 minute ago, Amadeus said: My fault, since it was my decision to remove P&R, I presumed the comments were directed at me. @AirwickWithCheese feels very strongly about this site, however the decision was all mine. I know some will leave over this, but our doors are always open if they decide to return. Well I hope no-one will and certainly I was perfectly happy before P&R existed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caretaker Posted November 3, 2016 Share #211 Posted November 3, 2016 1 hour ago, Amadeus said: It was not a good fit for this site any longer and it was running over into the other sections. I'd prefer no one leave, but we no longer offer an avenue to discuss politics or religion. It rarely ends and even more rarely, ends well. 43 minutes ago, Amadeus said: My fault, since it was my decision to remove P&R, I presumed the comments were directed at me. @AirwickWithCheese feels very strongly about this site, however the decision was all mine. I know some will leave over this, but our doors are always open if they decide to return. I don't need a forum devoted to P&R so removing it isn't important to me. However if I'd known there was going to be a blanket ban on all political or religious discussion regardless of whether it was polite and un-personalised I'd never have come here. I've taken some time out to consider my position since your intervention in the 'Donating to the cause' thread but reluctantly I'll have to respectfully withdraw. This will be my last post here for the foreseeable future. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted November 3, 2016 Share #212 Posted November 3, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Square Wheels Posted November 3, 2016 Author Share #213 Posted November 3, 2016 11 minutes ago, Caretaker said: This will be my last post here for the foreseeable future. That was not my intention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randomguy Posted November 3, 2016 Share #214 Posted November 3, 2016 1 hour ago, Caretaker said: I don't need a forum devoted to P&R so removing it isn't important to me. However if I'd known there was going to be a blanket ban on all political or religious discussion regardless of whether it was polite and un-personalised I'd never have come here. I've taken some time out to consider my position since you intervention in the 'Donating to the cause' thread but reluctantly I'll have to respectfully withdraw. This will be my last post here for the foreseeable future. I think the P& R forum was originally started because people who have deeply held strange beliefs one way or the other cannot help defending them against overwhelmingly different beliefs, going deeper and deeper into irrationality and obsessive-compulsive defense of these beliefs as something that needed to be respected above all other viewpoints. Experience has typically proven that this is true, despite not one shred of evidence one way or the other. Not one, to something so unknowable, to so many firmly convinced that they are correct. So, despite being mostly reasonable people and able to function out in the world just fine despite their differences, some people find that that 1/2 of a percent difference in one narrow area is enough to bash each other about the rectum and basically be dickheads to each other from time to time, in the quest to be "correct", never considering that what one person thinks shouldn't affect them in any way shape or form on this earth or any other. So that is why we can't have nice things, because we can't help ourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Karen_Cooper_Incident Posted November 3, 2016 Share #215 Posted November 3, 2016 On 11/2/2016 at 9:56 AM, jsharr said: Can we pray about this and then have a vote? Now, that's probably the best post of the year! Shu Fang 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onbike1939 Posted November 3, 2016 Share #216 Posted November 3, 2016 4 hours ago, Caretaker said: I don't need a forum devoted to P&R so removing it isn't important to me. However if I'd known there was going to be a blanket ban on all political or religious discussion regardless of whether it was polite and un-personalised I'd never have come here. I've taken some time out to consider my position since your intervention in the 'Donating to the cause' thread but reluctantly I'll have to respectfully withdraw. This will be my last post here for the foreseeable future. Well I for one am sorry about that and those that care about the forum should be also. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Karen_Cooper_Incident Posted November 3, 2016 Share #217 Posted November 3, 2016 On 11/2/2016 at 11:58 AM, dotman17 said: I personally came here because I was tired of the P&R scene over there. I did not officially get the boot until I came over here when I saw their bullshit monitoring and I called them on it. There used to be a former mod over there that had been with them for 10 years that came in here and confirmed our suspicions. I wouldn't assume that just because they had issues 'over there' that they are the problem. Say it ain't so. A mod from the other site stalked you over here? Was it Sui? Shu Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted November 3, 2016 Share #218 Posted November 3, 2016 1 hour ago, onbike1939 said: Well I for one am sorry about that and those that care about the forum should be also. I think that is 99% of the people here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted November 3, 2016 Share #219 Posted November 3, 2016 7 hours ago, Amadeus said: Please point out to me where I said anyone was not welcome? You did not. It was your cronies. They go by the name Cheese and Wilbur in case there is any confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted November 3, 2016 Share #220 Posted November 3, 2016 5 minutes ago, dotman17 said: You did not. It was your cronies. They go by the name Cheese and Wilbur in case there is any confusion. I would also like to be shown where I said that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted November 3, 2016 Share #221 Posted November 3, 2016 In before the move to P&R 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Some Old Guy Posted November 3, 2016 Share #222 Posted November 3, 2016 12 minutes ago, dotman17 said: You did not. It was your cronies. They go by the name Cheese and Wilbur in case there is any confusion. No one said that to anyone, as far as I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted November 3, 2016 Share #223 Posted November 3, 2016 It doesn't matter. I've been posting here for 3 years and AFAIK know I have not been a problem to anyone. Generally a bunch of nice people and I certainly don't want to get in the way of that. So you get a win-win. You close down P&R and get rid of the newcomers. And in the process you got rid of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtyhip Posted November 3, 2016 Share #224 Posted November 3, 2016 13 minutes ago, maddmaxx said: In before the move to P&R There is no P & R anymore. If this does get removed, then we can't even have a reasonable discussion about something that we don't agree with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted November 3, 2016 Share #225 Posted November 3, 2016 Can;t we all just get along? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted November 3, 2016 Share #226 Posted November 3, 2016 14 minutes ago, Dirtyhip said: There is no P & R anymore. If this does get removed, then we can't even have a reasonable discussion about something that we don't agree with. At this point the discussion seems to have moved from the reasonable to how many people are going to take their ball and go home. It seems to me that it's a done deal and instead of discussion this is just bitching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtyhip Posted November 3, 2016 Share #227 Posted November 3, 2016 Just now, maddmaxx said: At this point the discussion seems to have moved from the reasonable to how many people are going to take their ball and go home. I am not leaving at this point. I do hope he reconsiders. We need an avenue to post P & R. It was behind closed doors. Why create a whole new URL for it. That is like leaving. I posted a killer video today, so I am playing mt usual posting game. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtyhip Posted November 4, 2016 Share #228 Posted November 4, 2016 9 minutes ago, maddmaxx said: At this point the discussion seems to have moved from the reasonable to how many people are going to take their ball and go home. It seems to me that it's a done deal and instead of discussion this is just bitching. I am exercising my rights of protest against things I do not agree with. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedysmed Posted November 4, 2016 Share #229 Posted November 4, 2016 phew!!!! ....... after skimming thru this crap here. No wonder I rather spend my time cycling than on forums like this one. You can verify that on Strava. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Road Runner Posted November 4, 2016 Popular Post Share #230 Posted November 4, 2016 I don't see why anyone here feels they have a "right" to protest how this site is run. This isn't a democracy. We don't pay taxes here. This is a forum set up by an individual who bought and paid for the software, who has spent countless hours running and moderating the site and who is gracious enough to allow us to be members and post here for free. It is his site and he has the absolute right to limit what this forum will discuss as he sees fit. He has provided us a wonderful playground where we have all had much fun for the last three years, yet some of you, somehow, think you have the right to dictate how the site is managed. Sorry if I offend, but the negative posts on here have been offending me all day long. 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJM Posted November 4, 2016 Share #231 Posted November 4, 2016 1 hour ago, speedysmed said: phew!!!! ....... after skimming thru this crap here. No wonder I rather spend my time cycling than on forums like this one. You can verify that on Strava. Dude, according to the strava club, you get those miles in. kudos! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtyhip Posted November 4, 2016 Share #232 Posted November 4, 2016 I paid Sw wanted money to help. I think a lot of us did. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TobyOne Posted November 4, 2016 Share #233 Posted November 4, 2016 This is all my fault somehow. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digital_photog ★ Posted November 4, 2016 Share #234 Posted November 4, 2016 9 hours ago, Road Runner said: I don't see why anyone here feels they have a "right" to protest how this site is run. This isn't a democracy. We don't pay taxes here. This is a forum set up by an individual who bought and paid for the software, who has spent countless hours running and moderating the site and who is gracious enough to allow us to be members and post here for free. It is his site and he has the absolute right to limit what this forum will discuss as he sees fit. He has provided us a wonderful playground where we have all had much fun for the last three years, yet some of you, somehow, think you have the right to dictate how the site is managed. Sorry if I offend, but the negative posts on here have been offending me all day long. The @Road Runner is a smart bird. I will refrain from dropping any anvils on his head for at least one day. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onbike1939 Posted November 4, 2016 Share #235 Posted November 4, 2016 8 hours ago, Road Runner said: I don't see why anyone here feels they have a "right" to protest how this site is run. This isn't a democracy. We don't pay taxes here. This is a forum set up by an individual who bought and paid for the software, who has spent countless hours running and moderating the site and who is gracious enough to allow us to be members and post here for free. It is his site and he has the absolute right to limit what this forum will discuss as he sees fit. He has provided us a wonderful playground where we have all had much fun for the last three years, yet some of you, somehow, think you have the right to dictate how the site is managed. Sorry if I offend, but the negative posts on here have been offending me all day long. This seems a bit unfair as no one is speaking of "rights" but are expressing concerns at what has occurred.......something you yourself have certainly done in the past. Again...we all know this is not a democracy...and nobody has said the contrary apart from SW and I posted saying that this could not be true given that he is the sole owner, and with that recognition goes the right to limit what the forum will discuss...again something that no-one has disagreed with. When you use such terms as " the right to dictate" in this way, not only is this misleading but it only serves to inflame the situation and that is unhelpful in my view. This forum has an ethos which is admirable but I would have thought that this would embrace all of its members including those that post in P&R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted November 4, 2016 Share #236 Posted November 4, 2016 IMO it's a done deal. The longer the complaining goes on the more divisive it becomes. I will miss P&R here because it was one of the mild ones where one could hold real discussions but I can live without it. Those who can't are going to have to get used to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Square Wheels Posted November 4, 2016 Author Share #237 Posted November 4, 2016 1 hour ago, onbike1939 said: we all know this is not a democracy Hold on to that thought. 56 minutes ago, maddmaxx said: IMO it's a done deal. The longer the complaining goes on the more divisive it becomes. See above, I agree, the complaining has not done us any good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Kosciuszko Posted November 4, 2016 Share #238 Posted November 4, 2016 Say, SW, could you please set up a password protected B&C (Bitch and Complain) section? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onbike1939 Posted November 4, 2016 Share #239 Posted November 4, 2016 4 minutes ago, Amadeus said: Hold on to that thought. See above, I agree, the complaining has not done us any good. Hang on a minute...up the thread you said that this was a Democracy and I disagreed and now you say the above...don't get it. The important thing is that all concerned should put the good of the forum first.. but to be realistic people are going to be concerned about fairness and it's unrealistic to think they will not give voice to this. On both sides it's important how this is voiced and that it be done in a way that is reasonable and does not serve to further inflame the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Karen_Cooper_Incident Posted May 12, 2018 Share #240 Posted May 12, 2018 This is for jsharr. Couch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #241 Posted June 6, 2023 On 11/2/2016 at 10:49 AM, RJM said: P&R was the only reason I even came to this forum...so, bye. Happy birthday anyway, we miss you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #242 Posted June 6, 2023 On 11/2/2016 at 9:10 AM, F_in Ray Of Sunshine said: I make it a point never to discuss religion, politics or redheaded women. The good news is the latter is still on the table, if done tastefully of course. The bad news is you are long gone! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #243 Posted June 6, 2023 On 11/3/2016 at 8:22 PM, speedysmed said: phew!!!! ....... after skimming thru this crap here. No wonder I rather spend my time cycling than on forums like this one. You can verify that on Strava. Whatever happened to Speedy Smed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #244 Posted June 6, 2023 12 minutes ago, Ralphie said: Whatever happened to Speedy Smed? He’s probably still riding somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #245 Posted June 6, 2023 3 minutes ago, Longjohn said: He’s probably still riding somewhere. Unless he decided to stop like Forrest Gump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralphie ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #246 Posted June 6, 2023 On 11/3/2016 at 9:20 PM, Road Runner said: I don't see why anyone here feels they have a "right" to protest how this site is run. This isn't a democracy. We don't pay taxes here. This is a forum set up by an individual who bought and paid for the software, who has spent countless hours running and moderating the site and who is gracious enough to allow us to be members and post here for free. It is his site and he has the absolute right to limit what this forum will discuss as he sees fit. He has provided us a wonderful playground where we have all had much fun for the last three years, yet some of you, somehow, think you have the right to dictate how the site is managed. Sorry if I offend, but the negative posts on here have been offending me all day long. We sure miss RR! Especially @Square Wheels! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #247 Posted June 6, 2023 8 minutes ago, Ralphie said: Unless he decided to stop like Forrest Gump. He sure liked to ride 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeman564™ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #248 Posted June 6, 2023 dang, a few forgotten names Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #249 Posted June 6, 2023 2016 was a special year, wasn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickinMD ★ Posted June 6, 2023 Share #250 Posted June 6, 2023 The key thing is to stay away from political or religious arguments. If I mention I attended Catholic School, I'll stick to something about a spelling bee, art, etc. and not what the nuns told us about other religions, etc. Of course, I did mention one attempt at a religious quote where we wrote religious sayings in crayon on a piece of paper, coated the paper with cooking oil, then stuck the papers to the classroom windows to make "stained glass windows." One kid wrote, by mistake, "Greater love hath no man than to lay down his wife for a friend." That's more secular than religious, so I think that one's ok. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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