Bridge in Maryland collapsed!!!

[BuffJim]

@MickinMD Did you hear about it? Sure to snarl traffic.

 

 

[BuffJim]

[Parsnip Totin Jack ★]

Bad news. I saw this on Reddit: 

 

[Prophet Zacharia]

Snot good.

[Prophet Zacharia]

14 minutes ago, Parsnip Totin Jack said:

Bad news. I saw this on Reddit: 

If that’s a “partial collapse” I wouldn’t want to see a complete collapse.

[BuffJim]

7 people reported missing.

[Airehead]

A major incident. 

[Airehead]

One of my brothers works for Maryland Transportation Dept. He got called from Cecil County to Baltimore around 3 am

[Ralphie ★]

Someone’s insurance premiums are going up a tad!  I guess we’ll see this on Air Disasters someday. Sometimes they branch oot to train and ship wrecks. Sure shows how necessary the vast emphasis on prevention is. 

[Rattlecan ★]

That will mess up the morning commute. 

[smudge ★]

How the heck does this happen. I believe it was intentional. Horrible.

[Ralphie ★]

15 minutes ago, smudge said:

How the heck does this happen. I believe it was intentional. Horrible.

Oh, really?  Owl check the news now. Hadn’t heared that. 

[Mr. Silly]

It looks like the bridge fell on the stern superstructure too.  I hope there were no living quarters back there.  

This will mess up traffic but also shipping in and out of the harbor.

Horrible. 

[Randomguy]

Ah, they needed a new bridge anyway, probably.

[maddmaxx ★]

Oh say have you seen?

[Parsnip Totin Jack ★]

28 minutes ago, smudge said:

How the heck does this happen. I believe it was intentional. Horrible.

Early reports that I’ve read say that the ship was headed out of town with a harbor pilot at the helm, as required. The ship had trouble maintaining power. Without power, it’s at the mercy of the current, a floating bumper car. The 1.6 mile span is part of the Baltimore beltway (695) is used to bypass the harbor tunnels. East coast shipping will be impacted for months.

[maddmaxx ★]

3 minutes ago, Parsnip Totin Jack said:

Early reports that I’ve read say that the ship was headed out of town with a harbor pilot at the helm, as required. The ship had trouble maintaining power. Without power, it’s at the mercy of the current, a floating bumper car. The 1.6 mile span is part of the Baltimore beltway (695) is used to bypass the harbor tunnels. East coast shipping will be impacted for months.

I suspect this will be dealt with as a national emergency.  A maximum effort will be made to clear a usable channel.

[bikeman564™]

not good

[petitepedal ★]

11 minutes ago, maddmaxx said:

I suspect this will be dealt with as a national emergency.  A maximum effort will be made to clear a usable channel.

This...

[Rattlecan ★]

Something like 37 years ago, I was approaching the toll booth on that bridge when I was stopped by the commercial vehicle inspectors. They were checking for permitting and stuff like that, and there were some, er, shall we say, irregularities with my permits.

 Anyway, they parked me off to the side and one of them took me downtown to an office where I forked over about 45 bucks before they took me back to my truck and sent me on my way.

[Parsnip Totin Jack ★]

@Rattlecan for a Baltimore shakedown, $45 is pretty cheap. Doesn’t take into account the hours spent not earning any money.

[Rattlecan ★]

1 minute ago, Parsnip Totin Jack said:

@Rattlecan for a Baltimore shakedown, $45 is pretty cheap. Doesn’t take into account the hours spent not earning any money.

Yeah, but adjusted for inflation, that's prolly about $1,000 in today's money, right?

[Parsnip Totin Jack ★]

Light of day: 

[jsharr ★]

The news reports I have heard stated that the ship lost control. They alerted the city of Baltimore or the Port Authority that a collision with the bridge was possible.

[MickinMD ★]

3 hours ago, BuffJim said:

@MickinMD Did you hear about it? Sure to snarl traffic.

My alarm woke me up an hour ago and the bridge news was the first thing I heard.  I've been watching TV News since.

The bridge collapsed after being struck by a cargo ship leaving the Port of Baltimore.  There was a local pilot on board and the ship's captain was not on the bridge though that may have been routine.

At least 13 people are believed to have been thrown into the water and two were rescued, one in critical condition in the hospital, one who refused treatment and seems ok.  There were inspectors and maintenance people doing routine stuff when the bridge was hit.

The Francis Scott Key Bridge was completed in 1977 to complete the Baltimore Beltway loop at it's southern end.  It crosses the Patapsco River where many of us live on the western side and the Key Bridge and two tunnels were available to move us to the eastern side and vice-versa.  Now its down to the two tunnels - which many large freight trucks aren't allowed to use - or an hour's extra drive to go around the Beltway through its northern end.

A big problem is that the Port of Baltimore is virtually completely shut down because ships can't pass - you can see from the map below that the docks sticking out into the river are locked away from the Chesapeake Bay to the south by the fallen Key Bridge. Big ships have to use the center of the river because there is a 51 feet-deep dredged channel running from Baltimore Harbor to well down into the relatively shallow Chesapeake Bay and the bridge collapsed in the middle  My home, as the crow flies, is about 4 miles from the west end of the bridge. which spans almost a mile of open water.

[TrentonMakes]

Very sad for the apparent loss of life, for the impacts to shipping, and for all the extra traffic that will dumped into the tunnels until a new bridge can be constructed.  (it will take years)  In the collapse video there are clearly at least four work vehicles with yellow flashing lights on the span. 

But I also can't help but feel a little sad for the loss of a beautiful structure.  I only maybe ever drove over it twice, but it was clearly visible from some of the tunnel approaches.

One of those times I drove it was really late, after a wedding, and the road was deserted.  Surely, therefore, the timing of this incident could have been a lot worse. 

and the engineer in me can't help but be fascinated by watching how the bridge reacts to the strike.  I keep scrolling that video back and forth.  The far end actually lifts up a little before the truss tears apart, and when it comes back down it has enough momentum to destroy the footing it had been resting on. 

[Razors Edge ★]

1 hour ago, smudge said:

How the heck does this happen. I believe it was intentional. Horrible.

 

1 hour ago, Ralphie said:

Oh, really?  Owl check the news now. Hadn’t heared that. 

Intentional? No way.  But like many of these epic fails by container, tanker, and cruise ships, comes down to big mistakes on the bridge. 

[TrentonMakes]

6 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

like many of these epic fails by container, tanker, and cruise ships, comes down to big mistakes on the bridge. 

I feel like bridge designers had to assume the professionals driving these vessels could manage to stay within the roughly 1100-foot gap between the main span piers.  But s**t happens.

I just read that an average, fully loaded container ship weighs about 165,000 tons - larger ones, up to 220,000 tons.  That's an awful lot of momentum, even if it was moving at a snail's pace.  Were cargo ships of this size a thing when this bridge opened in 1977?

[MickinMD ★]

The Port of Baltimore is closed and will be for a while and it will affect the economy of the USA since Baltimore is the 9th largest port in the country and a lot of stuff is imported and exported through it including the #1 vehicle handling port in the USA.

The state and federal government are already organizing to get the channel in the middle of the river reopened ASAP.

Another note, a historical one:

There's a marker near the bridge that's said to be where Francis Scott Key was kept on a British ship (he was a lawyer negotiating for a civilian captive's release) when he wrote the Star Spangled Banner.

Expert historians say that's almost surely not true.  Fort McHenry, whose defense the song is about, was NEVER the intended invasion point. It was a diversion while the British Army - which had recently defeated Napoleon - was marching up the next peninsula to the East, "North Point," and was slowed by the Maryland Militia, then confronted with quickly-built earthworks over a mile long bristling with cannon, after Maryland had sent its regular troops to aid in the poorly-done defense of Washington, which was burned by the British.  The British wanted to burn Baltimore because it was where the fast-schooners were being built that raided British commercial shipping during the War of 1812.

When the British Army commander decided Baltimore couldn't be captured, he notified the Navy the troops were marching back to the end of the peninsula to reimbark.

The Navy got the word and stopped the diversionary bombardment of Fort McHenry at 3 am - THREE AM when Francis Scott Key could see nothing.  Key wrote that "the rockets' red glare, the bombs bursting in air, gave proof through the night that our flag was still there."  But, at 3 am there were NO rockets being fired and the British would tell him nothing, so he didn't know why the firing had stopped.  Had the fort been captured by the British?

The British ships, including the one Key was on, then moved to recover the British Army from North Point, out of sight of Fort McHenry.

So it's thought that Key may be speaking figuratively about seeing the flag after the battle.

[Razors Edge ★]

1 minute ago, TrentonMakes said:

I feel like bridge designers had to assume the professionals driving these vessels could manage to stay within the roughly 1100-foot gap between the main span piers.  But s**t happens.

I just read that an average, fully loaded container ship weighs about 165,000 tons - larger ones, up to 220,000 tons.  That's an awful lot of momentum, even if it was moving at a snail's pace.  Were cargo ships of this size a thing when this bridge opened in 1977?

There was an episode of Nova or similar about the Suez Canal crash a few years ago.  Big ass ships pass through there daily with "no problems" but just ONE mistake (seemingly a cascade of mistakes, really) add up to a really BIG problem.  If the Baltimore ship was having power issues and lost control, it really becomes a dice roll on how bad things will turn out, and this ship hit close to the "worst" case scenario and only the time of day limited loss of life   But if this happened one hour later when they were past the bridges, this is a "non news event".

[shootingstar]

41 minutes ago, TrentonMakes said:

I feel like bridge designers had to assume the professionals driving these vessels could manage to stay within the roughly 1100-foot gap between the main span piers.  But s**t happens.

I just read that an average, fully loaded container ship weighs about 165,000 tons - larger ones, up to 220,000 tons.  That's an awful lot of momentum, even if it was moving at a snail's pace.  Were cargo ships of this size a thing when this bridge opened in 1977?

I seriously wonder if the cargo ship size now is part of all this?  For this to happen on this magnitude, is incredibly rare.  Looks like a gross miscalculation to run into that bridge by ship. 

[MickinMD ★]

12 minutes ago, TrentonMakes said:

I feel like bridge designers had to assume the professionals driving these vessels could manage to stay within the roughly 1100-foot gap between the main span piers.  But s**t happens.

I just read that an average, fully loaded container ship weighs about 165,000 tons - larger ones, up to 220,000 tons.  That's an awful lot of momentum, even if it was moving at a snail's pace.  Were cargo ships of this size a thing when this bridge opened in 1977?

The big base at the bottom of the bridge has pilings rising from it called "dolphins" that are there to protect the main bridge support structures from being whacked. The momentum of a big, modern cargo ship was obviously too much for the dolphins.

I don't think the container ships were that big in 1977.  The Shipping Channel between well into the Bay and the Port of Baltimore has been dredged deeper a couple of times since to handle the ever bigger ships.

The smokestacks on the ship were putting out a lot of smoke just before the collision as either the ship was trying to reverse or turn.

[MickinMD ★]

When I was younger and even today, the BEST steak subs in the Baltimore area - overloaded with good steak - come from Captain Harvey's in Dundalk, MD.

Several of us would compile an order and pitch-in to pay the bridge toll and have someone drive across the Key Bridge to get them.

Later, some pretty good steak sub shops in our northern Anne Arundel County were close enough in quality that the toll and long trip were unnecessary.

Linda's Steak Subs in Brooklyn Park is my local favorite.  Linda, from the Philippines, is retired now, though I see and catch up with her every once in a while at St. Athanasius Church and Costco.  Her relatives run the sub shop.

[Kirby]

Every so often I'd think I had a really bad day at work, but things like this show what a bad day really is. I can't imagine being on the ship or on the bridge and seeing what's about to happen and being helpless to stop it. The loss of life is so sad and the practical impact to millions of people is immense.

[BuffJim]

22 minutes ago, shootingstar said:

I seriously wonder if the cargo ship size now is part of all this?  For this to happen on this magnitude, is incredibly rare.  Looks like a gross miscalculation to run into that bridge by ship. 

I’ve seen speculation/analysis of the video that indicated the ship was dealing with power failures.

[2Far ★]

2 hours ago, Parsnip Totin Jack said:

Early reports that I’ve read say that the ship was headed out of town with a harbor pilot at the helm, as required. The ship had trouble maintaining power. Without power, it’s at the mercy of the current, a floating bumper car. The 1.6 mile span is part of the Baltimore beltway (695) is used to bypass the harbor tunnels. East coast shipping will be impacted for months.

Well, that would explain why the ship wasn't even close to the center of the span.

[BuffJim]

2 hours ago, Parsnip Totin Jack said:

Early reports that I’ve read say that the ship was headed out of town with a harbor pilot at the helm, as required. The ship had trouble maintaining power. Without power, it’s at the mercy of the current, a floating bumper car. The 1.6 mile span is part of the Baltimore beltway (695) is used to bypass the harbor tunnels. East coast shipping will be impacted for months.

This corroborates analysis I had seen about power issues.

[maddmaxx ★]

The Chesapeake bay bridge tunnel has been closed for multiple days on three occasions due to ship or barge strikes.  It has been hit and briefly closed on multiple other occasions.

Shit happens.

When the Navy still had FBM submarines stationed in New London they had to stay on the ocean side of the Gold Star Bridge due to the fear of having them trapped upriver at the New London submarine base.

[Razors Edge ★]

9 minutes ago, maddmaxx said:

When the Navy still had FBM submarines stationed in New London they had to stay on the ocean side of the Gold Star Bridge due to the fear of having them trapped upriver at the New London submarine base.

Very good idea.  

[12string]

Not just the ships and the channel:

The I95 and I895 tunnels do not allow hazmats, not even propane tanks on RVs.  They must all use the Key bridge.  Now, they'll have to route through town.

Most trucks serving the port also use the Key bridge.

 

[Rattlecan ★]

3 hours ago, MickinMD said:

My alarm woke me up an hour ago and the bridge news was the first thing I heard.  I've been watching TV News since.

The bridge collapsed after being struck by a cargo ship leaving the Port of Baltimore.  There was a local pilot on board and the ship's captain was not on the bridge though that may have been routine.

At least 13 people are believed to have been thrown into the water and two were rescued, one in critical condition in the hospital, one who refused treatment and seems ok.  There were inspectors and maintenance people doing routine stuff when the bridge was hit.

The Francis Scott Key Bridge was completed in 1977 to complete the Baltimore Beltway loop at it's southern end.  It crosses the Patapsco River where many of us live on the western side and the Key Bridge and two tunnels were available to move us to the eastern side and vice-versa.  Now its down to the two tunnels - which many large freight trucks aren't allowed to use - or an hour's extra drive to go around the Beltway through its northern end.

A big problem is that the Port of Baltimore is virtually completely shut down because ships can't pass - you can see from the map below that the docks sticking out into the river are locked away from the Chesapeake Bay to the south by the fallen Key Bridge. Big ships have to use the center of the river because there is a 51 feet-deep dredged channel running from Baltimore Harbor to well down into the relatively shallow Chesapeake Bay and the bridge collapsed in the middle  My home, as the crow flies, is about 4 miles from the west end of the bridge. which spans almost a mile of open water.

Years (decades) ago, I hauled quite a bit of copper out of the Kennecott plant not far from your place. In fact, I think that was where I was headed when the incident I related above took place.

[smudge ★]

4 hours ago, TrentonMakes said:

 

and the engineer in me can't help but be fascinated by watching how the bridge reacts to the strike.  I keep scrolling that video back and forth.  The far end actually lifts up a little before the truss tears apart, and when it comes back down it has enough momentum to destroy the footing it had been resting on. 

I was looking at that too.

[TrentonMakes]

31 minutes ago, 12string said:

Not just the ships and the channel:

The I95 and I895 tunnels do not allow hazmats, not even propane tanks on RVs.  They must all use the Key bridge.  Now, they'll have to route through town.

Well, the Beltway North through Towson is an option, and not too much longer mileage-wise assuming you start and end on I-95.  But that northern loop of the Beltway is already much more congested than the south (Key Bridge) loop, in my experience.  I think they said the KB carries something like 31,000 vehicles per day.  By comparison, daily volumes on the northern loop (which provides many more lanes) range from about 140,000 to 215,000 vehicles per day (highest in the segment that overlaps I-83).

[Parsnip Totin Jack ★]

‘Snot just shipping either. Three cruise lines, Royal Caribbean, Norwegian, and Carnival, all use B-more ports. Royal Caribbean had a ship leave Saturday for a 12 night Southern Caribbean cruise. Return date is April 4. They have to figure out what to do with their passengers, whose cars or return flights depend on getting back to B-more. Carnival had a 7 day Bahamas cruise depart Sunday. 

[MickinMD ★]

There are a lot of road diversions and crowded side roads now locally.

I went shopping and was headed east on the Baltimore Beltway where the middle of three lanes forks with the right going south - where I was headed - and the left/straght goes toward the Key Bridge.  Two police cars with flashing roof lights were on the side of the road, a sign warned a lane ended and, sure enough, I had to merge from the middle lane to the slow lane.

I drove to Green Valley Shopping Center, my last hope of finding 12 oz. Pecan Nougat Mary Sue Easter Eggs for the young people in the family.

It was a success.

[MickinMD ★]

The ship sent a mayday call to the port, that it had lost power and couldn't steer and traffic was blocked from traveling on the bridge before it was struck.

I guess no power means they couldn't drop anchor either and there was no time to get tugboats out.

I worked at a shipyard one summer and one job I had was to order a pilot and tugboats for ships coming to us or leaving us.  Tugboats are used to get the ship safely in or out of slips at the docks.

Apparently they weren't able to talk to the 8 workers on the bridge.

6 are missing and they're now talking "recovery," not "rescue."

[MickinMD ★]

The news media is beating this story to death.  Local news is down to rerunning early reports where reports spoke in shocked tones that were a little too exaggerated.

I'm watching a Bones rerun and cleaning up the house.

[Razors Edge ★]

3 minutes ago, MickinMD said:

The news media is beating this story to death.  Local news is down to rerunning early reports where reports spoke in shocked tones that were a little too exaggerated.

I'm watching a Bones rerun and cleaning up the house.

In a year, five years, 25 yrs, etc., will you be telling your nephews and later grand nephews/nieces about the day the Bones rerun and vacuuming was done?

[Airehead]

This is from my brother. 20 contractors from a company called Bronner went in the water last night, and only two came out. 

[Randomguy]

32 minutes ago, MickinMD said:

The news media is beating this story to death.  Local news is down to rerunning early reports where reports spoke in shocked tones that were a little too exaggerated.

Although this one was unintentional, say hello to future terrorist attacks on infrastructure.  I am sure they are noticing the chaos this kind of thing can bring.