Popular Post Dottleshead ★ Posted February 14 Popular Post Share #1 Posted February 14 The director of System Test (his boss) was let go last week and my manager now reports directly to his boss. But last week when I met with him in our weekly one on one visit, he seemed razzled and a bit out of sorts. Well yesterday he divulged to me he was concerned about his own job last week and this week that there was a couple folks on his team he was worried about and that during his entire career at Seagate, and Microsoft, and now us, he always had the ears of VPs. He said this time he doesn't feel the respect and that his word was not being listened to. So in a nutshell, I'm one of those guys he's worried about. It's dumb but the upper crust apparently measures success by the number of bugs found (don't get me started) and the nature of my test pillar does not produce bugs. But it was clear my manager was being foreboding and I thanked him. He's a good man and can control only so much. I don't know what's going to happen but it does feel like the end is approaching. Maybe they ship me to some other department or even working within my team in another area but my future seems to be in doubt. If they decide to let me go and honor their severance pay, I should be able to make it about a year living off that, my savings, and Washington State's unemployment program. But it also means a year I'm not paying down on my retirement and it also means I'm starting somewhere as the low man on the pole. Maybe it's better out there than I think but the vibe I'm getting is that finding another job may not be as easy as it has in the past and certainly will be a new challenge working for the same tech company for almost 14 years. I have faith but not a lot of optimism. Anyhoo, I don't know what is going to happen. This could all be paranoia but I don't think so. When your boss is telling you he is concerned for his own job or that he may want to leave under the new conditions and hints to you that you are one of those on the chopping block, I'm not sure the writing on the wall could be any clearer. I've been hinting in here that I secretly want to get laid off. I guess I should be careful what I ask for. I also wish the Seahawks would win another Super Bowl but that's never going to happen so maybe I'm ok. 1 16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randomguy Posted February 14 Share #2 Posted February 14 Start by planting bugs to find, then find them. Then do it every day until you retire. I did hear that there is a sailing position opening up in TX, are you willing to relocate? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisL Posted February 14 Share #3 Posted February 14 It might be a good time to put some feelers out there so you have options. Your resume updated? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petitepedal ★ Posted February 14 Share #4 Posted February 14 Get your resume ready and put out feelers..maybe something will pop for you before they pop you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post JerrySTL ★ Posted February 14 Popular Post Share #5 Posted February 14 The best time to look for a job is when you have one. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikeguy Posted February 14 Share #6 Posted February 14 39 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: the upper crust apparently measures success by the number of bugs found (don't get me started) and the nature of my test pillar does not produce bugs. So... if you are good at writing code and testing and you don't have many (or no) bugs, your the poor performer? 18 minutes ago, petitepedal said: Get your resume ready and put out feelers..maybe something will pop for you before they pop you. This It's too late for this. 22 minutes ago, Randomguy said: Start by planting bugs to find, then find them. Then do it every day until you retire. I'd say your boss gave you a warning. Probably because he's fairly certain he will be on the chopping block soon, and he's got noting left to lose. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smudge ★ Posted February 14 Share #7 Posted February 14 I think it's good of him to give you a heads up. Now get busy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Posted February 14 Share #8 Posted February 14 When there are some layoffs it creates uncertainty and unease for the people who survive. It sounds like your boss is dealing with that now. Who knows what may happen, but it never hurts to make sure your resume and linkedin profile are up to date. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted February 14 Share #9 Posted February 14 Homeland security is always hiring. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsnip Totin Jack ★ Posted February 14 Share #10 Posted February 14 34 minutes ago, maddmaxx said: Homeland security is always hiring. A job with Customs and border protection would mean a shorter commute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted February 14 Share #11 Posted February 14 That was useful of him to let you know. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted February 14 Author Share #12 Posted February 14 8 minutes ago, shootingstar said: That was useful of him to let you know. 1 hour ago, smudge said: I think it's good of him to give you a heads up. Now get busy. He's a really good man. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted February 14 Share #13 Posted February 14 @Dottleshead Of course, one doesn't know all things you have done career-wise. I know some IT guys have moved more on the consulting/management side from pure programming and deep technical knowledge of 1 type of enterprise-wide system to customize it according to business client needs for 15 yrs. of their career before broadening out. Best wishes on the hunt to get you closer to the marathon finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Dottleshead ★ Posted February 14 Author Popular Post Share #14 Posted February 14 The thing is I'm a jack of many trades but a master of none. Tech interviews are exhausting usually meeting with 5 people a day -- each for an hour. And they throw all kinds of technical problems at you -- often nasty ones -- that they want you to solve. It's this way because every company has trade secrets so working at company X and executing Y is often very vague in descriptions. Tech problems on the other hand are generic ways to identify candidate strengths and weaknesses. So I personally would rather have the time off to prepare for a given interview. Even that is no guarantee but my history tells me it gives me a better -- much better -- shot at the job than just going on an interview cold on say a sick day. I can put out feelers but in no way do I have time to do my job and spend my free time studying for a hypothetical job. Hence I'm not sure I agree that getting a new job while you have one in my industry really matters. In every case but one --- when there was a dot.com collapse in seattle and the market was flooded with technologists --I have always gotten at least a 10% raise. But now that i'm senior and at the twilight of my career, I doubt folks are going to want to pay me what I'm making now. IF they do, they're going to have unrealistic demands. Honestly, I'm not looking to work harder at this point. In fact, I may just take a pay cut and do something else. Part of me loves what I do and another part of me would be happy as hell to get out of it. Things change so fast that I feel I'm always behind. It's almost impossible to stay on top of it unless you don't have a life or a large enough stake (like @Kzoo) to make it worth your time. 30 years in my industry is nothing to be ashamed of. In fact, I know very few that have done it. AI will be coming into it's own and soon they'll figure out how to eliminate tech jobs too. I got some thinking to do. But as it is, I'm leaning toward letting them push me out. Assuming severance (it's in contract) is fulfilled then I think this is the way to go. It'll allow me to look for a full time job -- because in my field it is a full time job to do so. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted February 14 Author Share #15 Posted February 14 47 minutes ago, Parsnip Totin Jack said: A job with Customs and border protection would mean a shorter commute. Blaine baby! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeman564™ Posted February 14 Share #16 Posted February 14 2 hours ago, Dottleshead said: I don't know what's going to happen but it does feel like the end is approaching. I know what you mean. prayers & vibes 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted February 15 Share #17 Posted February 15 @Dottleshead Now, you truly understand why I accepted a govn't job @51 yrs., with great benefits and perfect match to my experiences, skills and training in Calgary, which required me to live in a different province. So dearie and I made that work well. We viewed Vancouver and Calgary homes as each other's 2nd home to spend whatever amount time each person could/needed. He piled in his computer, clothing, etc. to be comfy...here also. But I know he and I weren't entirely "normal" compared to other couples. But I wasn't going to waste more time after months of searching, interviews with other employers, etc. Dearie saw it as whole new adventure. I'm so glad I DID NOT work in oil and gas industry, because 5 yrs. later, there were massive job cuts and shrinkages in that industry locally. 30,000 people left our area locally 2015-2017. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted February 15 Author Share #18 Posted February 15 7 minutes ago, shootingstar said: Dearie saw it as whole new adventure. Honestly, this is why I contracted for years. I'd have morons interview me as a contractor and tell me I was just looking for the next best thing. He didn't know he told me everything I needed to know about his company. Anyway, I no longer think this is an adventure (well a little bit) at this stage of my career. Instead of a challenge and eagerness to see what's on the other side, I've worked in enough places to know some companies do some things better in this business but they do so robbing Peter to pay Paul. In a nutshell it's very similar chit and very cutthroat for existence so it's expected they want folks that will sell out. I just don't know if I want to sell out -- particularly for the lower wage I'm likely to receive. This is not in stone but it seems the most likely outcome. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted February 15 Share #19 Posted February 15 22 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: Honestly, this is why I contracted for years. I'd have morons interview me as a contractor and tell me I was just looking for the next best thing. He didn't know he told me everything I needed to know about his company. Anyway, I no longer think this is an adventure (well a little bit) at this stage of my career. Instead of a challenge and eagerness to see what's on the other side, I've worked in enough places to know some companies do some things better in this business but they do so robbing Peter to pay Paul. In a nutshell it's very similar chit and very cutthroat for existence so it's expected they want folks that will sell out. I just don't know if I want to sell out -- particularly for the lower wage I'm likely to receive. This is not in stone but it seems the most likely outcome. I actually went up in pay scale. The previous job was a contract job. The govn't employer valued that contract job experience for a large construction engineering project on info. management side. After all, govn't has to manage large big-ass public infrastructure projects and records info. mgmt. on a large/complex scale. With the public yelling and screaming about accountability ...well, then we must have records evidence to show for it. Anyway if there is a common thread of work experiences to show you have elevated experience PLUS fantastic people skills. Which technical folks don't always have at the forefront. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted February 15 Author Share #20 Posted February 15 Just now, shootingstar said: I actually went up in pay scale. The previous job was a contract job. The govn't employer valued that job experience for a large construction engineering project on info. management side. After all, govn't has to manage large big-ass public infrastructure projects and records info. mgmt. on a large/complex scale. With the public yelling and screaming about accountability ...well, then we must have records evidence to show for it. Government beauracracy is not for the meek. Working for a private company like Boeing which is in bed with the FAA is mind blowingly painful. I don't know. Maybe I'll go teach for the healthcare industry. Instruct people how to use the software. Less money but a lot less stress. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted February 15 Author Share #21 Posted February 15 23 minutes ago, shootingstar said: I accepted a govn't job @51 yrs Tell me true. Did you ever attempt suicide?? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted February 15 Share #22 Posted February 15 32 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: Tell me true. Did you ever attempt suicide?? You mean working for gov'nt? I had previously also worked for provincial govn't for 12 yrs, in Ontario, also 1 yr. for provincial British Columbia legal aid. Interpersed with all this, several global and national private sector firms. (engineering, law and accounting). ****The better situation is to have a manager who themselves tends to be organized and sharp good player with other parallel and senior managers. That they are conscious of helping paving the way, to make your job a tad easier, not perfect, but liveable. Dottles what I loved the most for all jobs, was the sheer range of internal clients, their different problems and working styles. I always saw it as an ongoing opportunities to llearn about their world, while I was sussing out their info. business needs, teaching them certain software and corporate standards. To me, client work kept me sharp, challenged to learn how to partner with them to solve problems. My job was to inspire them to change their work habits for change management/business transformation, also some of them were internal leads for their business units, so I had help them understand they were change agents. To train others. In effect, I was the train the trainer. I was 1 of 6 staff in a central corporate team in last job. It was my job to also instill confidence that they could do it after mastering software features and corporate standards. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted February 15 Author Share #23 Posted February 15 So I should still consider Panama? I believe my wife will join me on a trip next year to explore, assuming I have a job that can pay for it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheep_herder ★ Posted February 15 Share #24 Posted February 15 36 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: Tell me true. Did you ever attempt suicide?? There are government jobs then there are government jobs. I had the good ones, once I got out of administration. Good luck in your situation and search! 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikeguy Posted February 15 Share #25 Posted February 15 1 hour ago, Dottleshead said: AI will be coming into it's own and soon they'll figure out how to eliminate tech jobs too. Maybe... this is a blessing in disguise? You have an opportunity to find something to do before there are thousands of tech people pushed out the door because AI replaced them and they flood the market looking for jobs too. Good luck with this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted February 15 Author Share #26 Posted February 15 Just now, Bikeguy said: Maybe... this is a blessing in disguise? You have an opportunity to find something to do before there are thousands of tech people pushed out the door because AI replaced them and they flood the market looking for jobs too. Good luck with this. Still one of my favorite posters. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Posted February 15 Share #27 Posted February 15 One of the nice things about having given thought to preparing for retirement is that it gives you more freedom in a potential job search. I know a number of people who wanted out of their jobs, but weren't mentally ready to retire yet. So they took either part time jobs or full time jobs that didn't have as extensive time requirements. They didn't match their prior incomes, but they made enough that they weren't drawing on their retirement savings, had medical insurance and also had a nicer quality of life with less stress. This gave their savings a chance to grow while they sort of transitioned to a retirement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groupw Posted February 15 Share #28 Posted February 15 Yep. Update that resume. Companies who are strictly numbers driven can be very problematic. Our company tries to do a “velocity” based system that reflects research and testing time as well as tickets and tasks completed. It’s not perfect but more fair than many. in my past job, I had to be eyes and hands for the IT dept of a Spanish corporation. They were quite the opposite. I would see an issue and know what needed to be done, but I didn’t have access so I would have to request their assistance. On my next visit, they would claim there was no problem, but what I had issues with was now working. I guess if nothing was wrong, that was their measure of success. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted February 15 Author Share #29 Posted February 15 51 minutes ago, Kirby said: One of the nice things about having given thought to preparing for retirement is that it gives you more freedom in a potential job search. I know a number of people who wanted out of their jobs, but weren't mentally ready to retire yet. So they took either part time jobs or full time jobs that didn't have as extensive time requirements. They didn't match their prior incomes, but they made enough that they weren't drawing on their retirement savings, had medical insurance and also had a nicer quality of life with less stress. This gave their savings a chance to grow while they sort of transitioned to a retirement. Spot on. And brilliant. I’m at that point I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted March 14 Author Share #30 Posted March 14 Well yesterday I had my review and for the 3rd straight year I did not see a bump in salary. Yesterday, there was a lot of time spent by my manager giving me background on the new regime change and about how he didn't have his new manager's ear. He personally thanked me for my hard work and contributions. So I found out last week that our company bonus was paying out at 107% and yesterday he told me my personal modifier was only 50%. (annual salary) x 8% x (company modifier) x (personal modifier) = bonus I have always received a personal modifier of at 90%. Nothing ever less. This year as a company we have excess and they are only giving me half of it. It's personally a slap in the face --- I know it and you know it -- and the writing has been on the wall. My bonus is going to be almost half of what I had calculated it to be. Look, I'm appreciative that I get a bonus and that money will come in handy. But when viewed as a litmus test to how much I'm valued, again it's in the dumpster and sending a message. I'm not happy about but I'm not going to sit around and sulk. The real question is how I should respond? What would you do? I believe my personal manager is trying to save me but he's fighting off his managers who would like to see me and other members on my team get slashed. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 14 Share #31 Posted March 14 2 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: Well yesterday I had my review and for the 3rd straight year I did not see a bump in salary. Yesterday, there was a lot of time spent by my manager giving me background on the new regime change and about how he didn't have his new manager's ear. He personally thanked me for my hard work and contributions. So I found out last week that our company bonus was paying out at 107% and yesterday he told me my personal modifier was only 50%. (annual salary) x 8% x (company modifier) x (personal modifier) = bonus I have always received a personal modifier of at 90%. Nothing ever less. This year as a company we have excess and they are only giving me half of it. It's personally a slap in the face --- I know it and you know it -- and the writing has been on the wall. My bonus is going to be almost half of what I had calculated it to be. Look, I'm appreciative that I get a bonus and that money will come in handy. But when viewed as a litmus test to how much I'm valued, again it's in the dumpster and sending a message. I'm not happy about but I'm not going to sit around and sulk. The real question is how I should respond? What would you do? I believe my personal manager is trying to save me but he's fighting off his managers who would like to see me and other members on my team get slashed. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsharr ★ Posted March 14 Share #32 Posted March 14 Sorry. That sucks. No one at our company got a bonus this year. Not even jelly of the month. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Razors Edge ★ Posted March 14 Popular Post Share #33 Posted March 14 5 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: The real question is how I should respond? What would you do? Get looking. Preserve cash. And do the absolute minimum required. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted March 14 Author Share #34 Posted March 14 28 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: Get looking. Preserve cash. And do the absolute minimum required. I agree with the last two statements. I’m not motivated to do much of anything. Definitely goodbye to those late nights. But I question whether I should be looking or not. If I’m let go there’s a severance due to me that’s pretty good. 6 months worth to be exact and then I can file for another 6 months of unemployment. Heck, that’d be enough time to ride my bike to you. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12string Posted March 14 Share #35 Posted March 14 Have you been looking? There is a large surplus of job openings right now, are there any you could take? Get laid off. Take the 6 month check. Take a month off then start your new job 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted March 14 Author Share #36 Posted March 14 2 minutes ago, 12string said: Get laid off. Take the 6 month check. Take a month off then start your new job I always liked you @12string. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted March 14 Share #37 Posted March 14 @Dottleshead Best of luck. At least you did get a bonus. Look around now..of course you gotta be careful not to pre-empt anything. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted March 14 Author Share #38 Posted March 14 11 minutes ago, shootingstar said: @Dottleshead Best of luck. At least you did get a bonus. Look around now..of course you gotta be careful not to pre-empt anything. I am grateful. It should be enough to eliminate some nasty debt accrued this last year (money well spent but nonetheless spent). But I was hoping to get the full amount and use that as part of the buffer in case termination comes. It leaves me with less reserves in the pantry than I'd like. Still being out of debt and going into debt with uncertainty is better than being in debt and going further into debt with uncertainty. Err -- something like that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted March 14 Author Share #39 Posted March 14 I also don't trust companies. It's in writing that if I'm laid off, they will pay me severance. But there are ways around that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razors Edge ★ Posted March 14 Share #40 Posted March 14 1 hour ago, Dottleshead said: Heck, that’d be enough time to ride my bike to you. Hop to it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted March 14 Author Share #41 Posted March 14 2 minutes ago, Razors Edge said: Hop to it! I feel like it'd be a great way to lose the 40lbs I want to. You could meet me in that bitchin' truck and trailer in the Appalachains or maybe crash @Allen's new pad. I mean he'll have one by then, right?? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted March 14 Share #42 Posted March 14 44 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: I always liked you @12string. Hey, How about me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longjohn ★ Posted March 14 Share #43 Posted March 14 3 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: I feel like it'd be a great way to lose the 40lbs I want. I think @BuffJim lost weight on his coast to coast ride. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted March 14 Author Share #44 Posted March 14 Just now, Kzoo said: Hey, How about me? Look Kazabooboo, you are now reminding me of my jealous cat that passed. Totally awesome but couldn't handle sharing the love with others. @12string doesn't get enough love in my view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingstar Posted March 14 Share #45 Posted March 14 44 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: I also don't trust companies. It's in writing that if I'm laid off, they will pay me severance. But there are ways around that. I totally agree. A company may find ways around it. You probably have a good manager that you report to. However he's only human, not made of Teflon to protect in future. In some areas of govn't when you don't get a salary increase if that's in writing...there are no mechanisms around it. Especially if one is in management category. Former employer: all management classified staff haven't had a salary increase for past 4 yrs. or something like that. No bonus. Because such info. is open to the public. Yes, unions did negotiate increase each time contract is renewed and that is also info. available to public. I really find it interesting that some people think all govn't managers slide on their asses. Some do ,while others take alot of public heat and work hard. Some general managers, have 3,000+ employees under them, with 10 sr. middle managers reporting direct to them, yet the general manager is earning approx. $200,000CAN. The public shouldn't get too irate, if they only knew the degree of public scrutiny and pressure to deliver services decently and hope someone doesn't get stabbed, dies or severely injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kzoo Posted March 14 Share #46 Posted March 14 10 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: Look Kazabooboo, you are now reminding me of my jealous cat that passed. Totally awesome but couldn't handle sharing the love with others. @12string doesn't get enough love in my view. Well that just hurt my feelers. I'll remember this when you are unemployed and come crawling for a job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dottleshead ★ Posted March 14 Author Share #47 Posted March 14 3 minutes ago, Kzoo said: Well that just hurt my feelers steelers. I'll remember this when you are unemployed and come crawling for a job. Meh. I'm just hardening you up for the upcoming NFL season. Russell Wilson for the win! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen ★ Posted March 14 Share #48 Posted March 14 26 minutes ago, Dottleshead said: crash @Allen's new pad. I mean he'll have one by then, right?? God I hope so 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddmaxx ★ Posted March 14 Share #49 Posted March 14 2 hours ago, Dottleshead said: Well yesterday I had my review and for the 3rd straight year I did not see a bump in salary. Yesterday, there was a lot of time spent by my manager giving me background on the new regime change and about how he didn't have his new manager's ear. He personally thanked me for my hard work and contributions. So I found out last week that our company bonus was paying out at 107% and yesterday he told me my personal modifier was only 50%. (annual salary) x 8% x (company modifier) x (personal modifier) = bonus I have always received a personal modifier of at 90%. Nothing ever less. This year as a company we have excess and they are only giving me half of it. It's personally a slap in the face --- I know it and you know it -- and the writing has been on the wall. My bonus is going to be almost half of what I had calculated it to be. Look, I'm appreciative that I get a bonus and that money will come in handy. But when viewed as a litmus test to how much I'm valued, again it's in the dumpster and sending a message. I'm not happy about but I'm not going to sit around and sulk. The real question is how I should respond? What would you do? I believe my personal manager is trying to save me but he's fighting off his managers who would like to see me and other members on my team get slashed. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisL Posted March 14 Share #50 Posted March 14 1 hour ago, Dottleshead said: If I’m let go there’s a severance due to me that’s pretty good. 6 months worth to be exact But how do you know this? Severance is like bonus and is at the whim of leadership. They are not legally obligated to give a severance and if your bonus got hosed, severances could too. I live by the motto of more options are better than less options. Starting to look for other opportunities gives you more options. You may find there is nothing out there better than your current situation but at least you know. Or maybe you’ll find something better. But unless you start that process you will never know. If I were in your shoes (and I had been) I’d be looking… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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